Director

When did you first consider--is this when you first considered dancing?$$After seeing Pearl Primus, yeah. I, I formed a--I worked that next week and we had meetings at Club L'Ouverture, I said, "I saw this wonderful woman dance and we should have--we should make--have a dance group here." And I asked other members of the club to come in to rehearsals. I, I was rehearsing people. Didn't know a thing, but (laughter) rehearsing people and making up dances, choreographing before I knew anything.$$That's something, so you just started, you know.$$(Makes sound), yeah. And then I went to audition at the New Dance Group for the scholarship and I got it, although I was sure I would be eliminated 'cause I didn't know anything. But they gave me a scholarship, they saw something.$$So what was the first thing--can you think of what you--what did you choreograph, I mean what did you--$$I choreographed a spiritual, 'Go Down Moses.' And I had all my fellow club members in a chain going around and they were bent over, things they could do, and I was improvising in the middle, breaking through trying to get out. When I think of it, I smile. It was so innocent and quite wonderful.$$So right after graduation [from DeWitt Clinton High School, Bronx, New York] or did you become a part of the New Dance Group before graduation or after?$$Before, 1947 was when I started the New Dance Group and I graduated about the same time, yeah.$$Okay, 1947, all right. She actually danced to 'Strange Fruit' too, right?$$Yes. (Singing), "Southern trees bare a strange fruit." She danced to a poem though, it wasn't sung.$$Well, tell us about your early days with the New Dance Group?$$Well, I got a scholarship and I was--I was going at that time to college, to City College [City College of New York, New York, New York] and so I would go and take early morning classes, about eight o'clock classes, then I'd go down to the New Dance Group which was on 59th Street between 5th [Avenue] and Madison [Avenue] at the time. And I would work with Sophie Maslow, Jane Dudley, William Bales, the New Dance Group company, and then I'd go back and finish more classes at CCNY, go home, have dinner, do homework, that was my life. And I started choreographing with the company in '51 [1951].$$Now, was this when you performed 'Saturday's Child' [Donald McKayle]?$$I did that first at the Club Baron in Harlem [New York, New York]. And that was Paul Robeson was part of it, and [HistoryMaker] Leon Bibb, [HistoryMaker] Harry Belafonte. I was a youngster in the group. And I did 'Saturday's Child,' Countee Cullen's poem.$$Okay, so this was a part of a larger performance of?$$No I was, I, I made--I made it as a solo for me. I spoke the poem and danced at the same time, which was unusual, people didn't do that, do that. So it was a dramatic dance and I was a homeless person.$$It was in a program that included Paul Robeson, and--$$Well, Harry Belafonte gave a benefit for Paul because he couldn't work and he couldn't leave the country. And I had done this dance and they asked me to do it at the Paul--and they said Paul would sing for me 'By 'n' Bye' and I said, "Okay I'd love to." I couldn't believe it. And I went down to the Golden Gate Ballroom, which was on Lenox Avenue [Malcolm X Boulevard], a little bit down from the Savoy [Savoy Ballroom, New York, New York] in the 40s, yeah. And I got there and there was no stage, just a bandstand with a piano, so it was large enough for a grand piano and then a few steps for the other instruments and it was carpeted. And there was Paul in the nook of the piano and Lawrence Brown [Lawrence Benjamin Brown] was sitting at the keyboard and I said, "Well if he's gonna sing for me, I'm gonna dance up and down this carpeted steps, and I did." But that was 'By 'n' Bye,' I didn't do 'Saturday's Child' at that particular performance. But it was very important for me. Big moment in my career.$All right, 'cause our next, next note is that in '59 [1959] you, you produced 'Rainbow Round My Shoulder' [Donald McKayle], right?$$Yes.$$Okay. Well, what is that about, and what--?$$'Rainbow Round My Shoulder' is about prisoners on a chain gang in the Deep South and they're brought to work on the roads to break rock to make gravel to lay the rock--gravel bed and then they put macadam and tar, blacktop on it for the roads. In fact the first song is, "Picks, rocks and gravel to make a solid road, but it wouldn't get done lessen captain had a gun. 'Cause is always being watched over by the overseer." And they're men that are prisoners and they dream of freedom and freedom comes to them in the guise of a woman. So there's one woman and seven men in the dance. And it's a--it's a huge success. As I said I've done it for other companies, I did it for the Batsheva Company [Batsheva Dance Company] in Israel, and I did it in Paris [France], did it in Buenos Aires [Argentina]. So it's a--it's a lasting dance.$$So this is--there's a theme although you've conceived of it as being something that's particular to the United States or something?$$Yes, it's definitely an American dance and the music are chain gang songs, and I got--the ones that I use in the--in the actual production were gathered by John [John A. Lomax, Jr.] and Alan Lomax on location as the men were working. There's one piece as a solo for the woman, it's called "Jinx Blues" and that was--she was heard a woman singing this song while she was washing clothes at the river and he recorded it on one of his field trips. (Singing), "I had a gal she was long and tall and moved her body like a cannonball." That's the female solo. And the woman who did it first, Mary Hinkson, was a dancer with the Martha Graham Company [Martha Graham Dance Company]. And in fact, on YouTube you can see her and me and Matt Turney dancing in a jazz piece called 'On the Sound' sitting--Long Island Sound. And that was done in '62 [1962] so we stayed as a kind of nice knit group there.$$How would you characterize your dancing technique in those days?$$It was very fluid, athletic, but very sort of muscular rather than light.$$Okay, okay. And what did dance critics say about you in those days?$$I got very good reviews from critics. And 'Rainbow' was hailed as a masterpiece.$$And it resonated with audiences abroad as well?$$Oh very much. I remember when we did it, well, I didn't do it, it was done by the Dayton Company, Dayton Contemporary [Dayton Contemporary Dance Company] in Russia. At the end of the performance there was just silence and then suddenly applause. And Charles Reinhart [Charles L. Reinhart] who was a director went out to the audience to see what was wrong. He said it was just like seeing your own history right in front of them in another form. So they just couldn't believe what they were seeing. And I did it, I went to Russia afterwards and I set it on Russian dancers. That was a wonderful experience.$$Okay, okay, so, so this is--how long did you perform--I mean did it perform for a season and then you--$$Well it performed for many seasons, it's a classic piece that's brought back by a company. And I'll--they'll call me to come in and restage it.