Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity | The HistoryMakers

Khalil Gibran Muhammad

Historian Khalil Gibran Muhammad was born on April 27, 1972 in Chicago, Illinois to Ozier Muhammad and Kimberly Muhammad-Earl. He completed his B.A. degree in economics at the University of Pennsylvania in 1993, and his Ph.D. degree in history at Rutgers University in 2004.

Initially intending to work in finance, Muhammad worked at Deloitte-Touche for almost two years before beginning his Ph.D. work in history. Following his graduation from Rutgers University in 2004, Muhammad worked as an Andrew W. Mellon Postdoctoral Fellow at the Vera Institute of Justice for two years. He then joined the faculty of Indiana University in Bloomington as an associate professor of history, where he taught for five years, focusing his teaching and research on the ideas of black criminality following the American Civil War. In 2011, Muhammad was selected as the next director of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture in Harlem. While there, Muhammad sought to expand the center’s outreach and funding, focusing particularly on programming to attract younger audiences. In late 2015, Muhammad announced he was leaving the Schomburg Center to join the faculty of Harvard’s Kennedy School as professor of history, race, and public policy. He was also hired as the Suzanne Young Murray Professor at the Radcliffe Institute for Advanced Study.

Muhammad released The Condemnation of Blackness: Race, Crime, and the Making of Modern Urban America in 2010, which was awarded the John Hope Franklin Publication Prize from the American Studies Association in 2011. Since its publication, he is a frequent contributor on the topic, including an interview with Bill Moyers in 2012 and 2016. Muhammad also delivered lectures at the City University of New York, Rutgers University, Indiana University, and many others. Muhammad’s commentary on the racial past of the United States and contemporary policing and criminality was published in the New York Times, Washington Post, National Public Radio and others. While under his direction in 2015, the Schomburg Center won the National Medal for Museum and Library Service.

Muhammad and his wife, Stephanie Lawson-Muhammad, have three children: Gibran Mikkel, Jordan Grace, and Justice Marie.

Khalil Gibran Muhammad was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on September 1, 2016.

Accession Number

A2016.011

Sex

Male

Interview Date

09/01/2016

Last Name

Muhammad

Maker Category

EducationMakers

Marital Status

Married

Middle Name

Gibran

Occupation

Historian

Library Administrator

Organizations

Fraternities and Sororities Together to End Racism

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Schools

University of Pennsylvania

Kenwood Academy

Rutgers University School of Arts and Sciences

Arthur J. Dixon Elementary School

Morgan Park High School

First Name

Khalil

Birth City, State, Country

Chicago

HM ID

MUH02

Favorite Season

Summer

State

Illinois

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2016.011.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/522155

Favorite Vacation Destination

Martha's Vineyard, Massachusetts

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

New Jersey

Interview Description

A2016_011_EAD.pdf

A2016_011_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

4/27/1972

Birth Place Term

Chicago

Speakers Bureau Region City

South Orange

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Tacos

Short Description

Historian Khalil Gibran Muhammad (1972 - ) was the director emeritus of Harlem’s Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, and the author of The Condemnation of Blackness: Race, Crime, and the Making of Modern Urban America.

Employment

Deloitte-Touche

Vera Institute of Justice

Indiana University

Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Harvard Kennedy School

Radcliffe Institute for Advanced Study

Favorite Color

Blue

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/522214

Timing Pairs

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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Khalil Gibran Muhammad's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his mother's personality

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his white maternal ancestors

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his mother's racial identity

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his father's career

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his father's relationship to the Nation of Islam

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about the schism in the Nation of Islam

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his father's frustration with the Nation of Islam

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his parents' relationship

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his family's legacy

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his earliest childhood memory

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes the smells of his childhood

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes the sounds of his childhood

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his relationship with his father's family, pt. 1

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his relationship with his father's family, pt. 2

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his early experiences of religion

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his church memberships

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers Arthur Dixon Elementary School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his early academic success

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his childhood activities

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers working at Hyde Park Computers

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his interest in computers

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls meeting Robert Earl Jones

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers the music of his teenage years

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about the violence in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about the origin of his name

Tape: 3 Story: 10 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers Ralph A. Austen

Tape: 3 Story: 11 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes segregation in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 3 Story: 12 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his early interest in journalism

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about growing up during an era of increased opportunity for African Americans

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his father's community engagement

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his decision to attend the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his experiences at the University of Pennsylvania

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about the alumni of the University of Pennsylvania

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about moving to the East Coast

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls the water buffalo incident at the University of Pennsylvania

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his protest against a racist student journalist, pt. 1

Tape: 4 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his protest against a racist student journalist, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 10 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his protest against a racist student journalist, pt. 3

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his graduation from the University of Pennsylvania

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his experiences during college

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls the arbitration of his assault by a campus security officer

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his position at Deloitte and Touche

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his decision to attend Rutgers University in New Brunswick, New Jersey

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls preparing for his doctoral studies in history

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers meeting his wife

Tape: 5 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about the topic of his dissertation

Tape: 5 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers conducting the research for his dissertation

Tape: 5 Story: 10 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers joining the faculty of Indiana University in Bloomington, Indiana

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his family

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his community in Bloomington, Indiana, pt. 1

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his community in Bloomington, Indiana, pt. 2

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls how he came to direct the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture in New York City

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his experiences as an instructor

Tape: 6 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers his fellowship at the Vera Institute of Justice in New York City

Tape: 6 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about studying criminal justice in the early 20th century

Tape: 6 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls studying racial discrimination in the criminal justice system

Tape: 6 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes the early responses to 'The Condemnation of Blackness'

Tape: 7 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his appointment to Harvard's Kennedy School

Tape: 7 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his interview at the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, pt. 1

Tape: 7 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his interview at the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, pt. 2

Tape: 7 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his start as director of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 7 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his generation of African American leaders

Tape: 7 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his tenure at the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 7 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad remembers his first year as director of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 7 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his management style

Tape: 7 Story: 9 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls the renovation of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 7 Story: 10 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes the leadership of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 8 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about expanding the audience of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 8 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls hosting an event with Chimamanda Adichie and Zadie Smith

Tape: 8 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his influence as director of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 8 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes the legacy of Jean Blackwell Hutson and Howard Dodson

Tape: 8 Story: 5 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his decision to leave the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, pt. 1

Tape: 8 Story: 6 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his decision to leave the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, pt. 2

Tape: 8 Story: 7 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad recalls his decision to leave the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, pt. 3

Tape: 8 Story: 8 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad reflects upon his tenure at the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Tape: 9 Story: 1 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his professorship at the John F. Kennedy School of Government in Cambridge, Massachusetts

Tape: 9 Story: 2 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his goals as a scholar

Tape: 9 Story: 3 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad reflects upon his legacy

Tape: 9 Story: 4 - Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his hopes for the African American community

DASession

1$1

DATape

1$7

DAStory

7$6

DATitle

Khalil Gibran Muhammad describes his father's career

Khalil Gibran Muhammad talks about his tenure at the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture

Transcript

Tell me about your father. Okay, give his name and a birthdate and what you know about his background (unclear)?$$Sure, so his name is [HistoryMaker] Ozier Muhammad, O-Z-I-E-R. He was born October 8, 1950 and grew up in Chicago [Illinois]. His mother [Eleanor Paschal Muhammad] was from Georgia and his father [Nathanial Muhammad] was born I believe in Michigan, but also might have come from Georgia, but he definitely grew up in, in Detroit [Michigan] where the Nation of Islam was first founded. My grandfather is about ninety, so he's still with us and my father grew up to a gigantic family with--he was one of ten and he was the second oldest son and I'm not sure if he is the third or second child, but he was very much a part of the Nation of Islam. It was his formative experience. He went to the University of Islam [Muhammad University of Islam, Chicago, Illinois] to be educated, talks about having taken some classes from his Uncle Wallace [Wallace Muhammad] who became Imam Warith Deen Mohammed, a very prominent member of a, sort of newly growing Sunni Islamic community that he lead after the Nation of Islam changed power from Elijah Muhammad to Louis Farrakhan [HistoryMaker Minister Louis Farrakhan], but I think the thing that makes my dad's story particular is of all of his siblings, he found his calling pretty early in life and as a late teenager started working as an assistant to a studio photographer on the South Side [Chicago, Illinois] not too far from the home base of the Nation, basically a mile east of where they lived in Chatham [Chicago, Illinois]. He grew up, my father grew up on 82nd [Street] and St. Lawrence [Avenue] and this studio was like on 83rd [Street] and Dorchester [Avenue] or Blackstone [Avenue]. So, once he started working in that space he decided that he wanted to be a photographer. He went to college and I think maybe one or two of his siblings eventually went to college, but my father went at the age when people eventually go to college at least as one imagines, so maybe nineteen he went to Columbia College [Columbia College Chicago, Chicago, Illinois], studied journalism and photography and graduated, started working at Ebony and Jet magazine and launched his career with people like Vandell Cobb and Bill Rhoden [William C. Rhoden] who just retired from The New York Times, also [HistoryMaker] Lerone Bennett was there. I mean it was a powerhouse as you well know back in 1974 when he joined. I have distinct memories of going to work with him and just meeting Mr. Bennett who handed me a copy of 'Before the Mayflower' ['Before the Mayflower: A History of Black America,' Lerone Bennett, Jr.] with a signed signature. My father was probably a little more of hippie than my mom [Kimberly Muhammad-Earl], sort of more counter-culturalist. Thinking about his background as a child of the Nation and then thinking about a changing world, I think he had a much greater racial consciousness than my mom and very-well read, very actively engaged in current events. Eventually, as he moved from Ebony, Jet to The Charlotte Observer to Newsday on Long Island [New York], began to travel the world, so in terms of my sense of my father by the time I was ten years old, he was incredibly focused on everything happening in the world, in the Reagan [President Ronald Wilson Reagan] years, anti-apartheid struggles, he eventually covered the famine in Ethiopia in 1985 for which he won a Pulitzer [Pulitzer Prize]. He took me to museums all of the time. He challenged me to think about the big picture all of the time. He exposed me to everyday events by taking me along with him to cover, particularly by the time he got to New York [New York], everything from sporting events to Ed Koch mayoral press conferences. So, I definitely attribute my father's own sense of wanting to be a journalist and to be engaged and active and learned, and not in the way that--my mother was an educator, she was certainly learned, but this was a different kind of interest and engagement with the picture that my dad passed on to me, and he's that way to this day. He reads voraciously, blogs, continues to cover things. He went to the Republication National Convention in Cleveland [Ohio], not as a paid employee, but as a curious person to cover it in case something happened. Of course, there weren't protests there and certainly talked about why that is, but that's, that's the dad that I remember, very fond of him, like my mother, but he, you know he pushed me more than my mom to find a, a significant purpose in life. I'll give you a good example. When I decided to leave public accounting to go to graduate school [Rutgers University, The State University of New Jersey, New Brunswick, New Jersey], my mother said, "Well, why do you want to be a teacher, you're not gonna make any money. You know that's a terrible idea, I was a teacher," you know. In her mind, she thought I could be much more as measured by a career as a business person, and what that might mean in terms of my financial future. My father said, "That's wonderful," you know, "How can I help?" So, you have a sense of the differences.$That's the public face, what about behind?$$Behind, wow (laughter). So, all right I mean so, so the good part that helped a lot was that I was appointed in, let's just say the beginning of November, I didn't arrive until the end of July. So, there was a long transition period between the news of my coming and my actual arrival and, in the meantime, because I was an academic and essentially had you know some flexibility, I mean in some ways I neglected my students my last semester at Indiana [Indiana University, Bloomington, Indiana], but between November and July I was coming to New York City [New York, New York] two times a month, sometimes more for various reasons. Some for specific meetings that were set up by Howard [HistoryMaker Howard Dodson] and the library more generally to understand processes. Some to meet people like Al Sharpton [HistoryMaker Reverend Al Sharpton], it just depended on whatever it was. Some--I was elected to Crain's Forty under 40 business magazine which was the library's doing. They nominated me and I was selected and so I had to come just for a photo shoot. Same thing happened with The Network Journal, African American business journal, Forty under 40, so I had to come in for that. So, for one reason or another I was coming in and I was spending time with Howard getting to know the staff and getting to know the colleagues at 42nd Street. So, I had a lot of experience coming in the door just from that exposure, and it definitely made me feel more confident, but there's nothing like showing up in a place like that the first day. Howard's, gone, you've got an assistant who's looking at you like you know, "What do you want me to do?" (Laughter) Phones ringing, there's mail that's already shown up months before I actually arrived, she hands me an envelope full of invoices that needed to be signed and dated so they could be processed, because Howard had been gone for a couple of weeks or a week or he hadn't--you know there was just stuff to do and people needed to move on with their work and they needed my input and I must say that one of the first things I said I'm gonna change here is I said, "I'm not signing every invoice, every single day that comes into this building." Howard had a different management style, it was more top down, and as a consequence of that he was approving everything, and I said, "I don't wanna have to approve everything. If you bought the paper you can approve it or your manager can approve it. Don't send me this stuff," and eventually that's how it worked and so early on that was my lesson, and the other thing I'd say in terms of the Harlem [New York, New York] community, it was very obvious to me that people needed to get to know me. That they had a great sense of propriety over the institution [Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture, New York, New York]. They cared deeply about the institution and they did not know me. They were willing to give me a wide berth because of my family heritage. I think the fact that I had written a book ['The Condemnation of Blackness: Race, Crime, and the Making of Modern Urban America,' Khalil Gibran Muhammad] that was so explicitly about racism and wasn't some soft weird, squishy academic take on things that they wouldn't know what my politics were. That helped. Some word of mouth helped because people had seen me at Hue-Man [Hue-Man Bookstore and Cafe, New York, New York] and/or heard me on the radio [WBAI Radio, New York, New York] and they came into embrace me, but mostly the onus was on me to prove myself worthy of the job and that's been--that meant spending a tremendous amount of time, effort and energy, visible, on the street, in the lobby, taking meetings with whomever asked for one.

Read more about Khalil Gibran Muhammad

Keith Clinkscales

Media executive and magazine publishing entrepreneur Keith T. Clinkscales was born on January 7, 1964 in Bridgeport, Connecticut. He received his B.S. degree in accounting and finance from Florida A&M University in 1986, and his M.B.A. degree from Harvard Business School in 1990.

In 1988, Clinkscales co-founded Urban Profile magazine and served as publisher and editor-in-chief until 1992, when he sold the publication to Career Communications Group. He then helped Quincy Jones establish Vibe magazine in 1993 and was named president and chief executive officer. He also founded the publication's digital counterpart, Vibe.com, in 1994, and helped launch Vibe’s Blaze magazine in 1998. From 1999 to 2003, Clinkscales co-founded and served as chairman and chief executive officer of Vanguarde Media, publisher of Honey, Heart & Soul and Savoy magazines.

In 2005, Clinkscales was hired to work for ESPN as senior vice president and general manager of ESPN Publishing. In 2007, he was named ESPN’s senior vice president of content development and enterprises, where he served as executive producer for ESPN Films’ documentaries, and scripted and unscripted projects including the 2011 launched Year of the Quarter Back; the acclaimed and Emmy-nominated 30 for 30 documentary series, Black Magic; Ali Rap; Kobe Doin’ Work; Renee; Catching Hell; A Race Story: Wendell Scott; The Tribeca Sports Film Festival; Elite 24; and the highest rated documentary in ESPN’s history, The Fab Five. Clinkscales was co-creator of ESPN’s award-winning TV magazine show E:60, the Homecoming with Rick Reilly show, and the adapted SportsNation show. He also oversaw the ESPN Classic network, ESPN Books, the ESPYs, and the X Games.

In 2011, Clinkscales founded and became chief executive officer of Shadow League Digital, a multi-platform sports news organization in partnership with ESPN. Under Shadow League Digital, he developed Shadow League Films and co-produced the 2012 Muhammad Ali 70 Special which aired on ESPN, as well as executive produced the ESPN documentary Benji. In 2013, Clinkscales was named chief executive officer of Sean “Diddy” Combs’ REVOLT Media.

His honors include two National Association of Black Journalists (NABJ) Excellence in Journalism Awards, two Peabody Awards, the National Magazine Award, and an Emmy nomination. In 2008, he was named one of Diversity MBA Magazine’s “Top 100 under 50 Diverse Corporate Executives.” In 2007 and 2009, Clinkscales was listed among the “Top 50 Minorities in Cable” by Cableworld Magazine; in 2014, he appeared on the CableFax Magazine “Top 100 Executives in Cable” list. Clinkscales has served as treasurer of the Apollo Theater Foundation Board of Trustees, as a member of PepsiCo’s Multicultural Advisory Board, and a member of the Advisory Board at UrbanWorld Media, Inc. Since 2012, he has served on the Board of Directors for Florida A&M University (FAMU) Foundation and the Board of Visitors for Howard University’s School of Communications.

Keith Clinkscales was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on July 18, 2014.

Accession Number

A2014.150

Sex

Male

Interview Date

7/18/2014

Last Name

Clinkscales

Maker Category

MediaMakers

Marital Status

Married

Middle Name

Terrence

Occupation

Magazine Publishing Entrepreneur

Media Executive

Organizations

Apollo Theater

PepsiCo, Inc. Multicultural Advisory Board

Yale Professional Publishing

Florida A&M University School of Business

Howard University School of Communications Advisory Board

Miller Coors Multicultural Advisory Board

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Prince Hall Free & Accepted Masons

Florida A&M University Foundation Board

Schools

Florida Agricultural and Mechanical University

Harvard Business School

Hillcrest Middle School

Center School

St Joseph High School

Search Occupation Category

MediaMakers:Print

First Name

Keith

Birth City, State, Country

Bridgeport

HM ID

CLI05

State

Connecticut

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

New York

Birth Date

1/7/1964

Birth Place Term

Bridgeport

Speakers Bureau Region City

New York

Country

USA

Short Description

Magazine publishing entrepreneur and media executive Keith Clinkscales (1964 - ) , CEO of REVOLT Media & TV and Shadow League Digital, co-founded Urban Profile magazine in 1988 and Vanguarde Media, publisher of Honey, Heart & Soul and Savoy magazines, in 1999. He also helped establish Vibe magazine, serving as president and CEO of Vibe Ventures from 1993 to 1999.

Employment

Urban Profile

Vibe Magazine

KTC Ventures

Vanguarde Media, Inc.

ESPN, Inc.

The Shadow League

Revolt TV

Read more about Keith Clinkscales

Robert Bogle

Newspaper chief executive Robert Bogle was born to John Bogle, a vice president and advertising director at The Philadelphia Tribune, and Roslyn Woods Bogle, an advocate and activist throughout the Philadelphia, Pennsylvania area. In 1973, he graduated from Cheyney State College with his B.A. degree in urban studies and attended the University of Pennsylvania’s Wharton School of Business and Finance to study marketing and economics.

Bogle was first hired at The Philadelphia Tribune in 1970, and was named advertising director in 1973. He served in that position until 1977, when he became director of marketing. From 1981 to 1989, Bogle worked as executive vice president and treasurer for the Tribune and was then promoted to president and chief executive officer. In 1991, Bogle was appointed president of the National Newspaper Publishers Association (NNPA), where he served two terms. Among his achievements as president of the NNPA were the dedication of the new national headquarters in Washington, D.C., the introduction of the NNPA’s national wire service, and the establishment of new and enhanced relationships with major national advertisers, including Toys R Us, Procter & Gamble, U.S. Air, K-Mart, and Walt Disney World Company.

Bogle has served on the boards of U.S. Airways Group, the Philadelphia Orchestra, the Pennsylvania Newspaper Association, United Way of America, the Zoological Society of Philadelphia, the Workforce Investment Board, and the African American Chamber of Commerce. In addition, in 2009, Philadelphia Mayor Michael A. Nutter appointed Bogle to the Independence Blue Cross board of directors.

Bogle is chairman of the Hospitals and Higher Education Facilities Authority of Philadelphia and serves as a commissioner of the Delaware River Port Authority. He has served as chairman of the council of trustees of Cheyney University and is an advisor to the United Negro College Fund, a member of the executive committee of the Boy Scouts of America, and a life member of Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity. He is also a founding member and president of the African American News and Information Consortium, a group of premier Black newspapers in some of the largest markets in the United States of America.

In 1993, Bogle was named one of Ebony magazine’s 100 most influential black Americans. In 1995, 1997 and 1999, the NNPA honored Bogle with the Russwurm Award, the highest honor to the “Best Newspaper in America.” Bogle received an honorary doctorate of humane letters degree from Drexel University in 2000.

Robert Bogle was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on June 11, 2014.

Accession Number

A2014.151

Sex

Male

Interview Date

6/13/2014

Last Name

Bogle

Maker Category

MediaMakers

Middle Name

Occupation

Newspaper Publishing Chief Executive

Organizations

National Newspaper Publishers Association

U.S. Airways Group

Philadelphia Orchestra

Pennsylvania Newspaper Association

United Way of America

The Zoological Society of Philadelphia

Workforce Investment Board

African American Chamber of Commerce

Independence Blue Cross

Hospitals and Higher Education Facilities Authority of Philadelphia

Delaware River Port Authority

Cheyney University

United Negro College Fund

Boy Scouts of America

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

African American News and Information Consortium

Schools

Cheyney University of Pennsylvania

Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania

Search Occupation Category

MediaMakers:Print

First Name

Robert

Birth City, State, Country

Philadelphia

HM ID

BOG02

Favorite Season

Fall, Spring

State

Pennsylvania

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2014.151.htm

Favorite Vacation Destination

St. Maarten

Favorite Quote

Never To Your Friends Your Secrets Tell, For One Day Your Friend May Be Your Foe And Out Into The World Your Secrets Will Go.

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

Pennsylvania

Interview Description

A2014_151_EAD.pdf

A2014_151_EAC.pdf

Birth Place Term

Philadelphia

Speakers Bureau Region City

Philadelphia

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Oxtail Stew, Pig's Feet. Chitlins, Roast and Turkey

Short Description

Newspaper publishing chief executive Robert Bogle ( - ) is the president and chief executive officer of The Philadelphia Tribune. He also served as president of the National Newspaper Publishers Association from 1991 to 1995.

Employment

The Philadelphia Tribune

Favorite Color

Blue

DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Robert Bogle's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Robert Bogle lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Robert Bogle talks about his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Robert Bogle talks about his mother

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Robert Bogle talks about his maternal grandfather

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Robert Bogle talks about his mother's academic abilities

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Robert Bogle talks about his father and his parents' views of race and character

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Robert Bogle talks about how his parents met, his likeness to them and lessons from his mother

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Robert Bogle describes his siblings

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Robert Bogle talks about his brother, HistoryMaker Donald Bogle, pt. 1

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Robert Bogle talks about his brother, HistoryMaker Donald Bogle, pt. 2

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Robert Bogle talks about his siblings

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Robert Bogle talks about his earliest childhood memories

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Robert Bogle talks about growing up in Darby, Pennsylvania where he attended integrated schools

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Robert Bogle talks about the lessons he learned from his father

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Robert Bogle talks about his religious upbringing

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Robert Bogle states his elementary school and recalls his elementary school teachers

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Robert Bogle talks about meeting influential African Americans as a child

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Robert Bogle talks about growing up knowing that he would have to choose between education, work, and the military after high school

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Robert Bogle talks about South Street in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania and black-owned theaters across the country

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Robert Bogle claims Philadelphia, Pennsylvania as the birthplace of the black community

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Robert Bogle talks about working as a newsboy, his educational experience, and moving to Yeadon, Pennsylvania

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Robert Bogle talks about attending Yeadon High School in Yeadon, Pennsylvania

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Robert Bogle talks about attending Cheyney State College in Cheyney, Pennsylvania

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Robert Bogle lists his instructors at Cheyney State College in Cheyney, Pennsylvania

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Robert Bogle talks about how he came to work at the Philadelphia Tribune

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Robert Bogle talks about his studies at Cheyney State College in Cheyney, Pennsylvania and working at the Philadelphia Tribune

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Robert Bogle talks about participating in the student union at Cheyney University of Pennsylvania in Cheyney, Pennsylvania

Read more about Robert Bogle

Carl Singley

Lawyer and educator Carl E. Singley was born in Alabama on March 21, 1946. In 1968, Singley graduated from Talladega College with his B.A. degree. He went on to receive his J.D. degree from Temple University in 1972 and his LL.M. degree from Yale Law School in 1974.

In 1974, Singley was hired as a law professor at Temple University and became a full professor at the age of thirty-three. He then served as dean of Temple’s law school from 1983 through 1987. At the time of his appointment, he was the first African American, the first Temple graduate and the youngest dean in the history of the law school. He retired as professor emeritus in 2004. Singley taught Civil and Appellate Procedure; Evidence; Jurisprudence; Legal Ethics; Municipal Finance; and State and Local Government Law. He has also authored and published numerous articles and essays on a wide variety of subjects, including legal ethics, criminal justice, jury trials, affirmative action, legal history, municipal finance, and leadership theory.

In 1987, Singley founded the largest African American law firm in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, which he managed for thirteen years before serving as a partner in two large Philadelphia law firms for eight years. Singley has been counsel to the law firm of Ciardi Ciardi & Astin since 2009. He has represented major corporations in litigation and transactional matters, and advised various local and state governments on a wide variety of federal, state, and municipal law matters. Singley has litigated and argued cases on employment law, contracts/business law, tort liability, libel law, constitutional law, and municipal law in various state and federal courts. He has also served in many public roles, including as the first deputy city solicitor for the City of Philadelphia, special counsel to the MOVE Commission, special counsel to the Philadelphia City Council, counsel to the Mayor of Philadelphia, special counsel to SEPTA, counsel to the Pennsylvania Convention Center, and chairman of the Mayor’s Commission on Construction Industry Diversity. He is admitted to practice in Pennsylvania and before the United States Supreme Court.

Singley’s civic and board memberships have included the Pennsylvania Convention Center Authority, North Star Bank, the Temple University Board of Trustees, the Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia, PNC Bank Advisory Board, the African American Museum in Philadelphia, the Zoological Society of Philadelphia, the Philadelphia Center City District, the Urban League of Philadelphia, and the Military Assistance Project. His recent awards include the A. Leon Higginbotham Award for Distinguished Service and the Thurgood Marshall Award; and he was named Diversity Attorney of the Year by the Philadelphia Bar Association in 2009.

Carl Singley was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on June 11, 2014.

Accession Number

A2014.167

Sex

Male

Interview Date

6/11/2014

Last Name

Singley

Maker Category

LawMakers

Marital Status

Married

Middle Name

Occupation

Lawyer

Educator

Organizations

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Sigma Pi Phi Fraternity

Pennsylvania Convention Center Authority

North Star Bank

Temple University

Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia

PNC Bank

African American Museum in Philadelphia

Zoological Society of Philadelphia

Philadelphia Center City District

Urban League of Philadelphia

United States Commission on Civil Rights

Mayor\'s Commission on Affirmative Action in the Philadelphia Police Department

Schools

Red Ore Elementary School

Wenonah High School

Southern Normal School

Talladega College

Temple University Beasley School of Law

Yale Law School

First Name

Carl

Birth City, State, Country

Bessemer

HM ID

SIN02

State

Alabama

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

Pennsylvania

Birth Date

3/21/1946

Birth Place Term

Bessemer

Speakers Bureau Region City

Philadelphia

Country

USA

Short Description

Lawyer and educator Carl Singley (1946 - ) Lawyer and educator Carl E. Singley (1946- ), of counsel to the law firm of Ciardi Ciardi & Astin, was a law professor at Temple University from 1974 to 2004, and served as dean of the University’s law school from 1983 through 1987. Singley also founded the largest African American law firm in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and served in many public roles, including as special counsel to the Philadelphia City Council.

Employment

Detroit Urban League

Temple University Law School

City of Philadelphia

Singley & Associates Attorneys at Law

Blank Rome

Wolf Block

Ciardi Ciardi & Astin

Read more about Carl Singley

Jim Vance

Broadcast journalist Jim Vance was born on January 10, 1942 in Bryn Mawr, Pennsylvania. In 1964, Vance earned his B.S. degree in secondary education from Cheyney State College (now Cheyney University) in Cheyney, Pennsylvania.

Upon graduation, Vance worked as a teacher in the Philadelphia Public Schools, and was then hired as a print journalist for The Philadelphia Independent. During this time he also worked weekends at the radio station WHAT-AM. In 1968, Vance moved to WKBS-TV in Philadelphia, where he served as a reporter and interviewed Muhammad Ali. The following year, Vance joined WRC-TV NBC 4 in Washington, D.C., where he has worked for over forty-five years.

At WRC-TV, Vance worked as co-anchor with Glenn Rinker between 1972 and 1976, and then as a co-anchor with Sue Simmons from 1976 to 1980. Vance and Simmons were one of the first African American co-anchors of a major market newscast. Since 1989, Vance has co-anchored with Doreen Gentzler and they are the longest-running anchor team in Washington, D.C.

Vance has earned numerous awards and honors, including seventeen Emmys and membership in the Silver Circle of the Washington Chapter of the National Association of Television Arts and Sciences. He holds the Ted Yates Award for outstanding community service and has been honored as “Washingtonian of the Year.” Vance was inducted into the National Association of Black Journalists Hall of Fame in 2007, and on May 2, 2008, he was inducted into the National Alumni Hall of Fame of Cheyney University of Pennsylvania. He has also appeared in the documentaries, Without Bias and The Nine Lives of Marion Barry; and the feature film State of Play.

Vance lived in Washington, D.C. with his wife, Kath McCampbell Vance. They have three children and one grandson.

Jim Vance was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on May 19, 2014.

Vance passed away on July 22, 2017 at age 75.

Accession Number

A2014.133

Sex

Male

Interview Date

5/19/2014

Last Name

Vance

Maker Category

MediaMakers

Marital Status

Married

Occupation

Broadcast journalist

Organizations

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Schools

Cheyney University of Pennsylvania

Ardmore Avenue Elementary School

Lower Merion High School

Ardmore Junior High School

Search Occupation Category

MediaMakers:Television

First Name

Jim

Birth City, State, Country

Bryn Mawr

HM ID

VAN07

Favorite Season

Fall, Spring

State

Pennsylvania

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2014.133.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/637241

Favorite Vacation Destination

St. Martin and Durango, Colorado

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

District of Columbia

Interview Description

A2014_133_EAD.pdf

A2014_133_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

1/10/1942

Birth Place Term

Bryn Mawr

Speakers Bureau Region City

Washington

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Macaroni and Cheese

Death Date

7/22/2017

Short Description

Broadcast journalist Jim Vance (1942 - 2017 ) anchored WRC-TV Channel 4 in Washington, D.C. for forty-five years. He was inducted into the National Association of Black Journalists Hall of Fame in 2007.

Employment

Philadelphia Public Schools

The Philadelphia Independent

WHAT-AM

WKBS-TV

WRC-TV NBC 4

Favorite Color

Blue

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/637259

Timing Pairs

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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Jim Vance's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Jim Vance lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Jim Vance describes his mother's background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Jim Vance talks about his relationship with his mother

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Jim Vance talks about his upbringing

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Jim Vance describes his mother's education

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Jim Vance talks about his maternal grandfather's family

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Jim Vance talks about his maternal family's lore

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Jim Vance remembers his mother's emphasis on etiquette

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Jim Vance remembers his maternal grandfather

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Jim Vance describes the Main Line community near Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Jim Vance talks about the relationship between his maternal and paternal grandparents

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Jim Vance describes his father's family background

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Jim Vance remembers his paternal grandfather, pt. 1

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Jim Vance remembers his paternal grandfather, pt. 2

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Jim Vance talks about his father's career as a plumber

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Jim Vance talks about his father's U.S. Army service in World War II

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Jim Vance remembers his father's aspirations

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Jim Vance reflects upon his upbringing

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Jim Vance talks about his parents' marriage

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Jim Vance remembers his family's expectations, pt. 1

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Jim Vance describes his likeness to his parents

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Jim Vance describes his earliest childhood memory

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Jim Vance remembers his community in Ardmore, Pennsylvania, pt. 1

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Jim Vance remembers his community in Ardmore, Pennsylvania, pt. 2

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Jim Vance remembers his early experiences of religion, pt. 1

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Jim Vance remembers his early experiences of religion, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Jim Vance describes his schooling in Ardmore, Pennsylvania

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Jim Vance talks about his skin condition

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Jim Vance remembers his early interest in journalism

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Jim Vance remembers his family's expectations, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Jim Vance remembers an encounter with law enforcement

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Jim Vance talks about his decision to attend college

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Jim Vance recalls his start at Cheyney State College in Cheyney, Pennsylvania

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Jim Vance talks about the development of his racial identity

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Jim Vance recalls lessons from Coach James Stevenson, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Jim Vance recalls lessons from Coach James Stevenson, pt. 2

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Jim Vance reflects upon his experiences at Cheyney State College, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Jim Vance remembers playing football at Cheyney State College

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Jim Vance reflects upon his experiences at Cheyney State College, pt. 2

DASession

1$1

DATape

3$5

DAStory

3$6

DATitle

Jim Vance remembers his family's expectations, pt. 1

Jim Vance remembers playing football at Cheyney State College

Transcript

I really loved my childhood. I loved being Little Jimmy [HistoryMaker Jim Vance], which is what they called me, for all of those years, because except for my mother [Eleanor Littlejohn Vance] and my [maternal] grandfather [Joseph Littlejohn], everybody else seemed to be really happy that I was around and treated me--and for a long--for a good number of years, I was the only male grandchild, and as such I was spoiled as much as you know, a kid in that level of life could be spoiled. Other side of that is, though, my man, expectations were really high. And I remember there were goodly periods of time where I was mad at those people. I adore them now, but I was angry. The last thing I was--I'll give you an example. For years (gesture) that, any time of day, all day, where an aunt or an uncle, and they were always around, they would (gesture) somebody would do that to me. The deal was, "Hold your head up boy. Do not lower your eyes because you do that you don't see the world." Number one, I remember their saying, all you see is your feet and the ground, you can't learn anything that way. Number two, you never give anybody any sense that you're defeated or dejected or whatever the case may be. Number three, you never, ever show any kind of weakness at all, you know, stand up and keep your head up. I used to hate 'em (laughter). I wanted to punch them when they did that to me. But after a while, you don't do this anymore because it's important you know to--"Okay, whatever you want." That was important to them that I meet, greet, meet, deal with the world and life with a sense of self in pride and whatever else the case may be, and I give them so much credit for that. Now it also had a downside. I was--B's were not good in grades. But whatever ball I was playing you expected to start. The job that I would go to you expected to do this job well. You asked me earlier about a favorite expression or something like that and I really have so many which is why I said, no. One of them among them, and my grandfather--good enough ain't never. He meant that, he lived by that good enough ain't never good enough, or is never acceptable as far as he was concerned. And so those kinds of expectations and demands put a lot of pressure on a kid and 'cause I didn't always feel up to it. Of course, when I grew up, you know I couldn't thank them more for raising the bar, but the bar was always held very, very high, and I was expected to (cough) meet it.$(Simultaneous) So did you play football for Cheyney [Cheyney State College; Cheyney University of Pennsylvania, Cheyney, Pennsylvania] (simultaneous)?$$(Simultaneous) Yeah, played football.$$Okay. What position did you play? I never asked you before, but should have asked.$$See how old you really are, I was a split end.$$Yeah, I know--$$Remember--what's his name, I can't remember his name at Army [United States Military Academy, West Point, New York] who was the first notable split end, call 'em wide receivers now, except we rarely went that far out normally, but it was you know just off the end. But those were the days of both ways. So if you started, you played sixty minutes of ball because, oh god, at Cheyney, because we didn't have scholarships or anything else, we had minimal number on the team. And when I say minimal, I mean we might have twenty-eight, twenty-nine guys, thirty guys. But if you started--and, oh, you were in the game, third quarter come and so you're here on offense and you don't make the first down, you just turn around and now you're a defensive man (laughter), because that's the way it goes. Bradley [Ed Bradley] and I used to always tell the story and some of the other guys of how--he was a center on the team and then middle linebacker when we turn it around. And in the first quarter--I'm sorry, I'm laughing at this 'cause it's just--you had to be there. First quarter Bradley, he's what, 255 [pounds] then kind of big for that time. "Army gang," you know the center calls the huddle, you know, and you huddle in, and he's enthusiastic, "Army gang!" And then the second quarter, "Army gang," third quarter comes, Bradley's like, "Over here, guys." And by the fourth quarter, "(Unclear) (makes sounds)," and that's all, you know, he doesn't even call it anymore, and we're all feeling the same way. And because, on each quarter, with the other teams who are at forty-five, fifty, fifty-five guys, what they put out, we're looking like, just filled with dirt and mud. Here come these new, brand new fresh uniforms, every quarter, we turn around and it's like, oh, my god, and it's a war for sixty minutes, but there's nobody on those teams that ain't my boy, 'cause when you're playing like that, and you know, they're being paid--not paid, but they're getting at least food, meal tickets. And when you're out there, just 'cause, you know, you like playing ball, the guys that are also with you like that who stay to the end of the season, 'cause a lot of times a lot of guys would come they'd stay until homecoming so they could get their picture taken and their parents and their girlfriends come see them, then they'd be off the team and they're gone. We ended most seasons--I remember my first--we ended our season with nineteen guys. We didn't have two full--eleven guys for us. You play with guys like that you're with them for all, for life.$$Okay.$$You don't lose their (unclear). Another thing for example that Cheyney gave to me.

Read more about Jim Vance

Louis Jones

Louis Jones is president of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc. and serves on the Board of Directors for the Black Contractors United. He was born on July 1, 1946 in Hunstville, Alabama to Arthur and Alberta Jones. His father was a farmer and construction worker in the South, but when his family moved to Chicago his father became a baker with the A&P grocery chain factories. Jones attended Tilden Technical High School before earning his Bachelor of Architecture degree from the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle in 1973. In 1969, Jones began working for Skidmore, Owings and Merrill architects. In 1973, Jones began working for McKee-Berger-Mansueto as a School Rehab Manager.

In 1975, Jones became a licensed architect and moved to San Francisco, where he worked for a private consulting firm. He moved back to Chicago three years later and began working for Schal Associates. Between 1978 and 1984, Schal Associates built the Avondale Center, Madison Plaza, the Chicago Tribune Printing Plant, and the Magnificent Mile. In 1984, Jones became president of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc., specializing in engineering, construction, management, consulting, and architecture. The following year, Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc. was part of the $1.7 billion renovation and expansion of O’Hare International Airport. The firm also was hired to work on Provident Hospital in 1990 and McCormick Place in 1997. In 2008, Jones' firm was hired to be part of the team to build the University of Illinois’, the James Stukel Towers student housing complex.

Since 1986, Jones sat on the Board of Directors for Black Contractors United and was elected Chairman of the Board in 1998. He was also selected to serve on the Mayor of Chicago’s Task Force for Minority & Women Business Development in 2005. Jones was a member of the Illinois Capital Development Board and has served as president pro tempore of the Illinois Department of Employment Security Advisory Board.

Louis Jones was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on May 27, 2010.

Accession Number

A2010.030

Sex

Male

Interview Date

5/27/2010

Last Name

Jones

Maker Category

BusinessMakers

Marital Status

Married

Occupation

Architect

Corporate Chief Executive

Organizations

Ace Technical Charter High School

American Institute of Architects

Black Contractors United

Student Nonviolence Coordinating Committee

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

National Organization of Black Architects

Advocate Charitable Foundation

Employment Security Advisory Board

Illinois Capital Development Board

Schools

Bret Harte Math and Science Magnet Cluster School

Edward Tilden Career Community Academy High School

University of Illinois at Chicago

First Name

Louis

Birth City, State, Country

Huntsville

HM ID

JON23

Favorite Season

Fall

State

Alabama

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2010.030.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/619567

Favorite Vacation Destination

Fishing

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

Florida

Interview Description

A2010_030_EAD.pdf

A2010_030_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

7/1/1946

Birth Place Term

Huntsville

Speakers Bureau Region City

Estero

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Steak

Short Description

Architect and corporate chief executive Louis Jones (1946 - ) was president of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc. and served on the board of directors for the Black Contractors United.

Employment

Skidmore Owings & Merrill

McKee, Berger & Mansueto

Schal Associates

Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

The Great Atlantic and Pacific Tea Company

Regal Theater

Johnson and Jones Architects

Favorite Color

Navy Blue

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/619570

Timing Pairs

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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Louis Jones' interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Louis Jones lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Louis Jones describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Louis Jones describes his father's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Louis Jones remembers his paternal uncle, James Jones, Jr.

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Louis Jones talks about his paternal grandparents

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Louis Jones talks about his family's history of enslavement

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Louis Jones describes his father's work at The Great Atlantic and Pacific Tea Company

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Louis Jones describes his family's community in Huntsville, Alabama

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Louis Jones describes his earliest childhood memories

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Louis Jones recalls his homes in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Louis Jones lists his siblings

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Louis Jones describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Louis Jones describes his experiences at Bret Harte Elementary School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Louis Jones recalls his early experiences of religion

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Louis Jones recalls his friends at Bret Harte Elementary School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Louis Jones remembers his near drowning at the Hyde Park YMCA in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Louis Jones describes his experiences at Tilden Technical High School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Louis Jones talks about his part time job at the Regal Theater in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Louis Jones remembers his extracurricular activities

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Louis Jones describes his decision to attend the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Louis Jones remembers the assassination of President John Fitzgerald Kennedy

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Louis Jones recalls his peers and professors at the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Louis Jones talks about the visiting professors at the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Louis Jones describes his architectural thesis

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Louis Jones talks about his favorite architectural style

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Louis Jones describes his part time position at Skidmore, Owings and Merrill LLP in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Louis Jones recalls his graduation from the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Louis Jones describes his organizational involvement at the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Louis Jones describes his duties at Skidmore, Owings and Merrill LLP in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Louis Jones remembers meeting his wife

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Louis Jones describes his transition to McKee Berger Mansueto, Inc. in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Louis Jones describes the role of a construction manager

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Louis Jones talks about his construction projects in California and Illinois

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Louis Jones describes his building projects with Schal Associates, Inc.

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Louis Jones describes the founding of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Louis Jones talks about his early projects at Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Louis Jones talks about the redevelopment of the Provident Hospital of Cook County in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Louis Jones recalls his work on the Harold Washington Library in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Louis Jones talks about the construction of the McCormick Place South Building in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Louis Jones talks about his involvement with the Rainbow PUSH Coalition and the Black Contractors United

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Louis Jones talks about his children

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Louis Jones talks about the success of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Louis Jones remembers the contracts secured by Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Louis Jones describes his current projects at Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Louis Jones reflects upon the specialty of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Louis Jones describes his role in the construction of ACE Technical Charter High School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Louis Jones talks about his work at the University of Chicago in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 6 Story: 6 - Louis Jones talks about his organizational involvement

Tape: 6 Story: 7 - Louis Jones describes the changes in building design after September 11, 2001

Tape: 6 Story: 8 - Louis Jones describes the process of building a hospital

Tape: 6 Story: 9 - Louis Jones describes his concerns for the African American community

Tape: 6 Story: 10 - Louis Jones talks about how he would like to be remembered

Tape: 6 Story: 11 - Louis Jones reflects upon his life

Tape: 7 Story: 1 - Louis Jones narrates his photographs

DASession

1$1

DATape

4$5

DAStory

8$3

DATitle

Louis Jones describes the founding of Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc.

Louis Jones recalls his work on the Harold Washington Library in Chicago, Illinois

Transcript

And from Schal [Schal Associates, Inc., Chicago, Illinois], where did you go? And what year was this?$$Well Schal, I came to work for Schal in, in June of 1978 from, from San Francisco [California], and worked on 200 South Wacker [200 South Wacker Drive, Chicago, Illinois], Tribune plant [Freedom Center, Chicago, Illinois]. Then Schal joint ventured with McHugh [James McHugh Construction Company, Chicago, Illinois] and I was the project director for the North Hall of McCormick Place [McCormick Place North Building, Chicago, Illinois]. And that went through a couple iterations where it went way over budget and they, they started trying to pull it back and work on it. And at that time, a friend of mine, Eric Johnson, who I went to school with [at the University of Illinois at Chicago Circle; University of Illinois at Chicago, Chicago, Illinois], we had a side business that was Johnson and Jones Architects [ph.]. So in the evening I would leave Schal, go around the corner and I had the license, I had gotten my architect's license. So I would look at the drawings that were being done, seal them, sign them, go home. So Schal kind of got wind of it. And this was in the era when there was big affirmative action pushes and Harold Washington, you know, was, was, was getting, getting in--in line to be mayor, you know, it was like in eighty--'82 [1982], '83 [1983] or something like that. So we started talking and they became a mentor company and they wanted to ow- hold a third of the deal and we were going to create Louis Jones Enterprises [Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc., Chicago, Illinois]. So I said okay, I don't wanna be accused of fronting for a big white company, so I gotta get somebody to look at this. So Sam Hurley [Samuel Hurley] was first deputy director, he's African American engineer, he's first deputy director of public works for the City of Chicago [Illinois]. And he was also on the city's affirmative action committee. Now they call it affirmative action. So I had Sam look at it. And he said, "Well, I know you Lou [HistoryMaker Louis Jones], I know you from Schal and all that, you know what you're doing, you're for real and all that kind of stuff. So why don't you, you know, move forward with it and see what." So then I turned it over to [HistoryMaker] Earl Neal who gave it to Anne Fredd [Anne L. Fredd] in his office to evaluate.$$Earl Neal was a black attorney?$$Yeah. And then they kind of got Ja- [HistoryMaker] James Lowry involved. And so Lowry help promulgate it as a good mentor protege thing. So I went with it. And so--and the 29th of February it was incorporated as Louis Jones Enterprises. I was living in Oak Park, Illinois and so they had my home address for a while, and then I had a small office at 440 North Wells [Street]. And so that's how I started a company. And we had a five year buyout deal and all that. In about three years, I bought them out because we were, you know, just something we wanted to do. So we started out working on McCormick Place North to bring it back, because they had sort of mothballed the job because the legislature had not funded it. And then the O'Hare Development Program came about. And by the fall of that year, in 1984, when I opened the company, by the fall of that year I had ten employees and they were all working at O'Hare field [Chicago O'Hare International Airport, Chicago, Illinois]. And I had been spending quite a bit of time in the prior year as an employee of Schal and then later on as a consultant helping the team that was doing all the budgeting for the O'Hare Development Program. What is the United terminal [United Airlines Terminal 1] gonna cost. What's the inner outer taxi way relocation and widening gonna be, the second taxi way bridge. Did a lot of analysis and studies and stuff on that. And so Dick Unsulman [ph.] was the executive director of the O'Hare Development Program and he sent out a--like an ultimatum, "Either Lou Jones is full time working with me on the O'Hare program," because he was involved with McCormick Place somehow, "or he's working on McCormick Place, which is it." Well my business and my employees were all at O'Hare, so I moved to the O'Hare thing and let the McCormick Place thing go. And I became deputy director of construction management for the O'Hare Development Program. So all of the facilities stuff, they had a deputy director for facilities and a deputy director for infrastructure. So this guy, Dan Kaiser [ph.], was over all the civil stuff like runways and roads, and stuff like that. And I was over all the buildings, like the terminal buildings, the crash fire rescue stations, that kind of stuff. And within a couple years I had twenty-five or thirty employees out there and me spending full time there when I started to pick up other work was getting to be a strain, so I brought in Joe Doddy [ph.] who's still working out there for somebody else, who's a classmate of mine, to be the deputy director for facilities.$What was the next big project that your, your firm [Louis Jones Enterprises, Inc., Chicago, Illinois] had? You had Provident [Provident Hospital of Cook County, Chicago, Illinois], you had O'Hare [Chicago O'Hare International Airport, Chicago, Illinois]?$$The Harold Washington Library [Harold Washington Library Center, Chicago, Illinois] came up and McCormick Place South [McCormick Place South Building, Chicago, Illinois] in the '90s [1990s]. Both were, were done--they had international design competition design build--they wanted design build. And we teamed with a group that call themselves the SEBUS Group, it was Schal [Schal Associates, Inc., Chicago, Illinois], Epstein [A. Epstein and Sons International, Inc., Chicago, Illinois], U.S. Equities [U.S. Equities Realty LLC; CBRE Group, Inc.] and I forget what the B in there was [Hammond, Beeby and Babka, Inc.; Hammond, Beeby, Rupert, Ainge, Inc., Chicago, Illinois]. But we did something like 10, 15 percent of the deal. We had the union crew that--a construction manager operates sort a like general contractor, they have what they call temporary facilities and controls or general conditions. We had a crew of about fifteen laborers, carpenters and one operator, and Barb [Jones' wife, Barbara M. Jones] went through a lot of people because we insisted on hiring African Americans, and we had some issues with that, and we had to really go to--we actually had to do some stuff. 'Cause I wrote a very ugly letter that everybody asked me to burn or shred because if it got to the Sun-Times [Chicago Sun-Times] or something--'cause I was threatening them that they were mani- manipulating me into laying off black folks and hiring Mexicans and white people unfairly. Because I would put a black carpenter out there and--or a black laborer and, and the, the other firms that were involved wou- would complain that they were, they were too slow, they didn't know what they was doing or something. And I said, you know, you're trying to tell me that a journeyman carpenter doesn't know what he's doing, you know, give me a break, you know. So finally--when you start a construction job there's ebbs and flows. At the beginning there is some site work. They're, they're doing the foundations and stuff and you need some laborers around there to do cleanup. You might have a little bit of safety with a carpenter or whatnot, and maybe those guys will get three weeks work or a couple months work, then they get laid off because there's a lull. And then when that thing starts to come out of the ground and it's a project that's big as Harold Washington Library, then you need a full time cleanup crew and you need a couple of people there to do backup safety where the subcontractors don't do the barriers where people might fall, you know. And if you're the general or you're the construction manager you better see that they're done. And even if it's somebody else's duty and then you just back charge them for it. So we had those kind of people. And so that came to nearly fifteen people, and I think we had one white person and one Hispanic, everybody else was black. And there was always some issue. So finally I wrote a letter and I said, "Look, you know, you've manipulated me into laying off my whole crew and then you call and said you wanted these people back and you recommended its people that wasn't black." "We don't want--we don't want that written down, where are the rest of those letters." And so then the edict came down, leave Lou [HistoryMaker Louis Jones] alone, let him hire the people that, you know, he sees fit, as long as they're doing the job.

Read more about Louis Jones

Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford

Dr. St. Elmo Wallace Crawford, Jr., was born on September 26, 1952, in Washington, D.C. He is the son of Dr. St. Elmo Crawford, Sr., and Maime Crawford, a musician. He is also the great grandson of prominent businesswoman Maggie Walker. Crawford graduated from Calvin Coolidge High School in 1970 and received his B.S. degree from Hampton University in 1973. He later earned his D.D.S. degree from Howard University Dental School in 1977.

Crawford fulfilled his Residency at Georgetown University College of Dentistry and earned his certificate in pediatric dentistry and orthodontics at Children’s Hospital in 1982. He began teaching at Howard University College of Dentistry in the Department of Pediatric Dentistry in 1977. Crawford went on to become an assistant professor in the College of Dentistry for Howard University in the Department of Pediatric Dentistry. In addition to his teaching, Crawford began a private practice in 1983 which later expanded to three practice locations.

Crawford is an active member of the National Dentist Association and the Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity. He is also a member of the National Dental Association, Robert T. Freeman Dental Society, American Society of Dentistry for Children, Academy of Dentistry International and the American Association of Dental Examiners.

Crawford was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on July 27, 2008.

Accession Number

A2008.097

Sex

Male

Archival Photo 1

Interview Date

7/27/2008

Last Name

Crawford

Maker Category

MedicalMakers

Middle Name

Occupation

Dentist

Organizations

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

National Dental Association

Schools

Brightwood Elementary School

Calvin Coolidge Senior High School

Hampton University

Howard University College of Dentistry

Georgetown University

Archival Photo 2

First Name

St. Elmo

Birth City, State, Country

Washington

HM ID

CRA04

Favorite Season

Summer

State

District of Columbia

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2008.097.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/420473

Favorite Vacation Destination

Bermuda

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

District of Columbia

Interview Description

A2008_097_EAD.pdf

A2008_097_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

9/26/1952

Birth Place Term

Washington

Speakers Bureau Region City

Washington

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Mussels

Short Description

Dentist Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford (1952 - ) ran three private practice locations in Washington, D.C. He was also an assistant professor in Howard University College of Dentistry's Department of Pediatric Dentistry.

Employment

Howard University College of Dentistry

Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford, D.D.S. and Associates

Favorite Color

Blue

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/420480

Timing Pairs

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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his maternal great-grandmother, Maggie Lena Walker

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his mother

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his father's family history

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his father

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes how his parents met

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his father's career

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his parents' personalities

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his parents' civic involvement

Tape: 1 Story: 12 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford remembers his mother's recovery from cancer

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his earliest childhood memory

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes the Brightwood neighborhood of Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls his early education

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls the Poor People's Campaign

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls the riots of 1968 in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls his childhood hobbies

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls Calvin Coolidge High School in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls the Hampton Institute in Hampton, Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls his biology professor, James B. Abram, Jr.

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls his activities at the Hampton Institute

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls Howard University College of Dentistry in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford remembers his growth spurt in college

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his advice to young dentists

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about the National Dental Association

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls entering pediatric dentistry

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford remembers meeting his wife

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his mentorship of young dentists

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about community dentistry

Tape: 3 Story: 10 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about trends in dentistry

Tape: 3 Story: 11 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his plans for the future of St. Elmo Crawford, D.D.S. and Associates

Tape: 3 Story: 12 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes his concerns for the African American community

Tape: 3 Story: 13 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford reflects upon his life

Tape: 3 Story: 14 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about working with pediatric patients

Tape: 3 Story: 15 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford reflects upon his legacy

Tape: 3 Story: 16 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about his children

Tape: 3 Story: 17 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford describes how he would like to be remembered

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford narrates his photographs

DASession

1$1

DATape

3$3

DAStory

2$9

DATitle

Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford recalls Howard University College of Dentistry in Washington, D.C.

Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford talks about community dentistry

Transcript

Did you decide to go to Howard [Howard University College of Dentistry, Washington, D.C.] because of your fa- your fa- your father's [St. Elmo W. Crawford, Sr.] background there?$$At the time I really kind of wanted to come back to the District [Washington, D.C.], I, I kind of wanted to reacquaint myself with my roots here and my friends and all and I wasn't ready to venture off to another city and, you know, a strange environment again. I really wanted to stay at Hampton [Hampton Institute; Hampton University, Hampton, Virginia] another year, but since that was vetoed then my next preference was to come back to the District.$$Okay, well what was dental school like?$$It was, it was a maturing process for me because I was the youngest person in my class. I was twenty years old and many of my classmates had second careers. They were pharmacists prior to coming to dental school, one was a Nassau [ph.] engineer, a few--one was a microbiologist, and many of them had worked and then saved their money and decided to come back and, you know, go to professional school. So the average age in my particular freshman class was probably between twenty-nine and thirty-two. Most of the, you know, members of my class were that, and then we had a number of them like twenty-five, twenty-six, twenty-seven, that had been out and at least worked a year. So at, at twenty years old I was considered the baby in the class and many of them took me under my wing, under their wing and we sat down and studied, you know, countless hours at night, so it was a maturing process. And it--associated with people three, four, five, six years older. Matter of fact, the oldest person in our class was forty-two in my freshman class. So, it, it was very demanding and, and luckily I was around very, very mature individuals who were committed and many of them had families and their wives were working and, you know. They had given up jobs, you know, relatively good paying jobs to come to dental school so they were very, very serious about, you know, the, the academics and their pursuit, so there wasn't a lot of time for foolishness. And, and then being around those particular individuals who had made such a sacrifice to come back to professional school helped me quite a bit, and, you know, my ma- maturation process and, and all. So, it was, it was again a, a really enlightening experience. I met some wonderful people, again, many of them who are my lifetime friends now, you know, going through four years of dental school is like going through pledging in the fraternity. So the people that you go through these experiences with are, you know, become a part of your, your being so to say.$$About how many were in your class when you went through?$$We started out with a 110 in my freshman class and 60 graduated. So we, we lost, you know, clearly a third of the class just about.$$Um-hm.$$Through academic, you know, failures and financial, you know, problems and family problems and all that. So, so it's--it's a, it's a difficult four years, you know, when you're struggling to try to work and go to school and support families and all that and like I said, most of my class were, were much older than I was. I was blessed to be in an environment where, you know, I did have support and I had a family structure and I really wasn't out there, you know, fending for myself so to say. So I was, I was extremely blessed in that, that respect.$On the community side of it, what would--how would you assess the state of dental health in the black community? And what recommendations would you have (simultaneous)?$$(Simultaneous) There are many programs which need some, some help. The, the Medicaid program, of course, provides medical services for children under twenty-one, who do not have medical insurance or who do not have the ability to pay for dental services. And that program has gone through a number of changes over the past ten or fifteen years from straight Medicaid which is paid for by the city and, and federal government to third party programs which are administered by, you know, HMOs [health maintenance organizations] and PPOs [preferred provider organizations]. Many of the foreign children that are in the area, Hispanic and other, because they do not have language skills, or the ability to sign up for these programs, many of them are lacking dental care because they don't have the insurance to cover it, they don't have the finances to pay for it and they also are not able to really enroll in these programs or take advantage of the federal and, and, and, and city programs that provide services because of the language barriers. So I think from a community point, you have to really provide, you know, services to, especially children that are in need, and you have to assist parents in getting these children signed up for programs that will support their, their, their dental and medical needs. And I think you have to provide some mentoring and guidance to kids in terms of, you know, encouraging them to go on and pursue professional careers whether it's medicine, dentistry, dental hygiene, dental technology, I think all of these are, are excellent opportunities for, for young students coming out of high school to set their, their, their sights on these professions. Because they're, you have to start early to, to get into these professions and I think the earlier they're exposed to them, and their first exposure obviously is through their, their medical professionals that they, that they encounter. I think it provides an excellent opportunity for mentoring and encouragement and guidance for these young youngsters.$$Okay. Now, now are there any particular dental syndromes that are unique to the black community, or that--?$$I don't think there're in, there're, there're too many that are unique. I think there are many that are endemic in, you know, those who are too poor to afford dental services, and I think those that are not educated and to the importance of dental hygiene and dental care. And education is just one of the, the big landmarks that separates, you know, good dental health from great dental health to poor dental health is they just don't know, you know, the importance of, of, of their teeth and dental maintenance. So, I think education is probably the biggest obstacle that we must overcome in the, in the community.

Read more about Dr. St. Elmo W. Crawford

Dr. Rene Martin Earles

Dermatologist Dr. Rene Martin Earles has developed techniques and products formulated for the uniqueness of African American skin and hair. Dr. Rene Martin Earles was born on October 31, 1940, in New Orleans, Louisiana. Growing up in Washington, D.C., Earles graduated from Coolidge Senior High School in 1958. Following high school graduation, Earles attended Howard University, where he received his B.S. degree in chemistry and biology in 1963. Upon graduation, Earles attended the College of Medicine at Howard University and finished with his M.D. degree in 1967. Throughout his tenure in medical school, Earles worked at the Freedmen’s Hospital.

Earles held a residency at the District of Columbia General Hospital in general surgery. The following year, 1969, he began a second internship in orthopedic surgery. In 1970, Earles joined the United States Navy to direct the Medical Clinic at Sand Point Naval Air Station in Seattle, Washington. While in the Navy, he received a preceptorship in dermatology at the University of Washington, beginning his career as a dermatologist. In 1972, Earles moved to Chicago, Illinois, to begin a dermatological residency at Rush-Presbyterian St. Luke’s Hospital. Three years later, Earles opened a private practice in Chicago’s Bronzeville neighborhood. In 1976, Earles attended a course in hair transplantation in Arkansas. The following year, he developed his own surgical technique for treating alopecia marginalis, hair loss at the hairline, in African American women. This procedure is called the “Earles’ flap” and revolutionized the field of hair transplantation for black females. This led to his appointment as chairman in the Division of Dermatology at Mount Sinai Hospital in Chicago from 1979 until 1981.

Earles presented his findings of strategies for hair loss management for African American males and females at numerous conferences and magazines including the Journal of the National Medication Association, Ebony, American Academy of Facial Plastic Surgery, Essence, and the Journal of Dermatologic Surgery and Oncology. Earles has served as a consultant for African American personal care lines including SoftSheen-Carson and Fashion Fair Cosmetics. This early work helped prepare Earles to launch his own skin and hair product line, Dr. Earles, in which he has received two United States patents for an anti-dandruff formula and the process by which it is made. The company, Dr. Earles, LLC, is operated by his son, Robert Earles.

Earles is a member of multiple professional organizations including the National Medication Association, the American Academy of Dermatology, and the Chicago Dermatologic Society. He was named by Black Enterprise magazine as one of the top African American physicians. Earles has twenty thousand active patients and has treated over two hundred thousand people in the course of a forty-year career.

Accession Number

A2008.084

Sex

Male

Interview Date

7/14/2008

Last Name

Earles

Maker Category

MedicalMakers

Middle Name

Martin

Occupation

Dermatologist

Organizations

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Schools

Calvin Coolidge Senior High School

Howard University College of Medicine

Sylvanie F. Williams School

Hugh M. Browne Junior High School

Charles Young Platoon School

University of Washington

Howard University

First Name

Rene

Birth City, State, Country

New Orleans

HM ID

EAR04

Favorite Season

Fall

State

Louisiana

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2008.084.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/612039

Favorite Vacation Destination

Mexico

Favorite Quote

If A Man Is Out Of Step With His Companions, It Is Because He Hears A Different Drum.

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

Illinois

Interview Description

A2008_084_EAD.pdf

A2008_084_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

10/31/1940

Birth Place Term

New Orleans

Speakers Bureau Region City

Chicago

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Crab Cakes

Short Description

Dermatologist Dr. Rene Martin Earles (1940 - ) developed his own surgical technique, The Earles Flap, for treating alopecia marginalis in African American women. He also created his own skin and hair product line: Dr. Earles.

Employment

District of Columbia General Hospital

Dr. Earles

Rush University Medical Center

Howard University Hospital

Lorton Reformatory

U.S. Navy

Favorite Color

Brown

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/612041

Timing Pairs

0,0:1653,39:15573,264:26613,410:58930,812:60210,835:60850,850:75954,1101:79554,1181:80418,1192:81570,1216:108350,1537:108931,1545:118568,1652:121478,1715:145892,2018:151550,2132:167117,2425:173508,2553:191920,2907:193705,2954:198975,3071:207710,3116:208030,3128:259502,3634:262274,3690:271280,3817$0,0:3320,58:7055,129:7387,134:7802,140:9462,156:9794,161:10292,168:29365,372:32595,417:52286,719:53234,735:57590,770:58130,811:60470,824:61280,835:61910,844:62270,895:77432,1093:79088,1123:88867,1241:97105,1390:110114,1556:110519,1562:115703,1737:125500,1817:125848,1822:126892,1842:133591,1973:142630,2056:146908,2108:149512,2144:152860,2190:153883,2204:161998,2310:163272,2325:166800,2337:174360,2400:175200,2409

DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Dr. Rene Martin Earles' interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about the origin of his middle name

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his mother and maternal grandmother

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his father's education

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his father's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his likeness to his father

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his travels along U.S. Route 61

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles lists his parents' siblings

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his parents' marriage

Tape: 1 Story: 12 - Dr. Rene Martine Earles describes his earliest childhood memory

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers Sylvanie F. Williams School in New Orleans, Louisiana

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his family's move to Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his neighborhood in New Orleans, Louisiana

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his childhood in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his relationship with his siblings

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his elementary schools in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his early religious experiences

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about the evolution of his career aspirations

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers Hugh M. Browne Junior High School in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his early personality

Tape: 2 Story: 11 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers Calvin Coolidge High School in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his paternal grandmother's lessons

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his experiences at Calvin Coolidge High School in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his decision to attend Howard University in Washington, D.C.

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his high school prom

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his early employment

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his introduction to Howard University

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his experiences at Howard University

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his decision to Howard University College of Medicine

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his early experiences at Howard University College of Medicine

Tape: 3 Story: 10 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his struggle with attention deficit disorder

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers his professors at Howard University College of Medicine

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his residency in orthopedic surgery

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers practicing medicine at Lorton Reformatory in Lorton, Virginia

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls studying dermatology at the University of Washington in Seattle, Washington

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his residency at Rush University Medical Center in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about the early years of his dermatology practice

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes the Earles flap

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about the development of his dermatology practice

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his foray into product development

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his hair and skin care product line, Dr. Earles, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles remembers meeting John H. Johnson of Johnson Products Company

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his work for Fashion Fair cosmetics and Soft Sheen Products, Inc.

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his article on the Earles flap

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his method of treating keloids

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles talks about his hair and skin care product line, Dr. Earles, pt. 2

Tape: 5 Story: 8 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes his children

Tape: 5 Story: 9 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles reflects upon his life

Tape: 5 Story: 10 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recites his poem, 'Bull Spit,' pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 11 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles recites his poem, 'Bull Spit,' pt. 2

Tape: 5 Story: 12 - Dr. Rene Martin Earles shares a verse from his song, 'Oh Baby'

DASession

1$1

DATape

4$5

DAStory

7$1

DATitle

Dr. Rene Martin Earles describes the Earles flap

Dr. Rene Martin Earles recalls his foray into product development

Transcript

Nineteen ninety-five [1995] you opened your office [in Chicago, Illinois], your practice--$$Seventy-five [1975].$$Nine- I'm sorry, '75 [1975], and then in '76 [1976], what gets you involved in hair transplants?$$Well, what got me involved in hair transplants, was that I think I heard the word (laughter). Somebody mentioned hair transplants, I said, "What, what?" And somehow that just grabbed my imagin- I mean, you can do that? And once I heard it, I wanted to do it. And I'm s- I got involved in doing it, so when I finished--now, I heard about it before I--my residency [at Rush University Medical Center, Chicago, Illinois] was up, and they didn't offer that type of training during the residency, so when I finished, then I pursued it with some vigor. And then I said, ah, I'll give myself about ten years, I'll become the expert in hair transplants in black people. People will fly all over the world to see me, I'll be in Ebony magazine, and dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, dah. So, ten years later, I was an expert, and people were flying all over and I was in Ebony magazine back in--$$Just what you said would happen did happen. But tell me about the procedure, it was first done because you have what's called the Earle flaps [sic. Earles flap], but it was a Juri flap (simultaneous)?$$(Simultaneous) Yeah, well, you see there were two, there were two--there was a plastic surgeon whose name is Jose Juri, J-U-R-I, he's in, I think, in Argentina, and his brother, Carlos [ph.] I think. One was a (unclear)--I mean one is a plastic surgeon, and one was a dermatologist, and they created this, this piece of surgery I think a strip of hair from the side, and you can rotate it around, and put it on the front, and so it gives you a strip of hair around here. It was a fairly complicated procedure. And I had a friend of mine who was in Philadelphia [Pennsylvania], who was getting a hair transplant from a doctor in California, Newport Beach, Constantine Sparkle [ph.] was his name, who had been down to Argentina to learn this flap, amongst some other things. Now he had went and invented something called the scalp reduction, where you just cut out the bone there, your scalp, you throw it away, and pull the scalp together (gesture) like that. And you may do that serially (gesture); you may start off suppose this is--with this much bone (unclear), you cut out once, you got that much, you cut out again, that much, cut out again, you see, until it's gone--if the scalp will, you know, allow you to do that. And so, I would fly out with Harold Pierce [Harold E. Pierce], who's his name, in Philadelphia to, to see Dr. Sparkle do this procedure. And so when I had an opportunity, I did it on people, started off on my brother in law (laughter). And so I did that, and then I went out there one time and he was doing this, this Juri flap. I said, oh my god, not in my office will I do that (laughter), and I ended up doing it. And then, I addressed the problem of African American women who had their hair loss here (gesture) where people have and it's sort of--just sort of reverse Juri flap that works, that just simply hadn't been done. Nobody had considered doing it because people said, "Eh, there's nothing you can do about that," so.$$So, the Earle flap that you created is for women?$$Yeah, or anybody who has hair loss here (gesture). Who has hair loss here? African American women had the hair loss thing, so it's a flap of hair from here (gesture), and you lift it up, see, it's like this, you lift it up, and it goes there (gesture). So you could get full thickness of hair here, but you had to have some thickness of the hair here. If you have hair loss here, there's nothing to move, but you can take that from there, and put it in there, and it just changes the whole thing.$You were gonna talk about the mixing of the medicines for your hair care line [Dr. Earles] I believe, tell me about that.$$Yeah, what would happen was that I've always been a mixer of things and so--which is what goes on in dermatology, 'cause dermatologists have been mixing things for probably since the profession started. And so, I had always been very curious about mixing things and a lot of the prescriptions that I wrote were compounds. A dermatologist's only specialty in medicine when you can say take a little of this, pinch of that, quarter teaspoon of this, oh, add, and an eighth of a teaspoon of that, and mix it up and put it on. I mean you can't be a cardiologist and say take half of this pill and then a piece of that one (laughter). And so, as a result, now I got a lot of experience in that, seeing what would work and what wouldn't. And you see, you can do it, and as long as these are approved substances, you can put it on people. You see, that would be called experimentation, it's something else, but it's sort of like the art of medicine in dermatology. Now, there was one pharmacy in the City of Gary [Indiana] who could mix things, and he was slow, he was arrogant, and he was expensive, and people would take their prescriptions to him and he'd say, "Well, it's gonna be a week, and it's going to cost you, dah, dah, dah, dah, dah." "Oh my god, I need that stuff now," and they would complain to him, and then he would, he would say, he would reach in, or, "Here, take this back and take it somewhere else." And they would take the prescription and as they would turn to leave, he would say, "But you'll be back." And by god, they had to come back because he was the only one in Northwest Indiana that knew how to do that, they'd come back with their tail between their legs. They complained to me so bitterly, that I started, I said, oh, let me see, let me see. I had a major in (laughter) biology and chemistry, another major in pharmacology, oh, it's nothing to this. And I started mixing things and preparing them. And that led from--and then, in order to cut costs, then I said, oh, there's a 4 percent thing of this, why don't you just get thing and you know, the raw materials, and I started getting the raw materials, and I could weigh down the cost, but it also gave me a vehicle for creating things, and so that's how I got to creating different products.

Read more about Dr. Rene Martin Earles

Steven Roberts, Sr.

Entrepreneur Steven Craig Roberts was born on April 11, 1952, in St. Louis, Missouri, to Delores Talley Roberts and Victor Roberts. Roberts grew up the second of four siblings, and was particularly close to his brother, Michael V. Roberts. The family was educated in the St. Louis Public School System, and Roberts began working early on, earning money working around the neighborhood and delivering newspapers.

Roberts attended Clark University in Massachusetts as a Danforth Fellow, and initially considered a career either in the ministry or in medicine. Roberts instead began studying at Washington University in St. Louis to get his law degree. In 1974, while he was attending law school, his brother Michael began Roberts-Roberts and Associates, which became a business and construction management firm in St. Louis.

Roberts graduated with dual J.D. and M.A. degrees in 1978, and the following year, ran to become an alderman in St. Louis, joining his brother Michael who had been elected two years previously. Roberts was the youngest person to become an alderman in St. Louis, where he served along with his brother, Michael, and longtime friends Mike Jones, Virvus Jones and Wayman Smith; he held this position until 1993. During his terms as alderman, Roberts was the chief sponsor of the St. Louis Center and Union Station developments in St. Louis, and was particularly involved with major redevelopment projects for the city.

In 1981, Roberts and his brother began Roberts Broadcasting, a new branch of the duo’s business empire. After establishing WRBU-TV in St. Louis, the Roberts brothers would go on to build eleven more successful television stations across the country, from Santa Fe, New Mexico, to Mobile, Alabama. During the building of these stations, the Roberts became more familiar with the business behind construction, inspiring the founding of Roberts Construction Company in 1989. This additional holding supplemented a growing commercial and residential development company the brothers established in 1982 known as Roberts Brothers Properties, an organization that has processed more than $25 million in redevelopment.

In 1999, the first Sprint PCS-affiliated Roberts Wireless store opened in Jefferson City, Missouri, the only PCS company that is entirely African American-owned in the country. Today, the Roberts Companies are a $460 million, thirty-four-company organization; these companies include an aviation division, a gated Bahamas community and real estate development. Roberts serves as president of the company, while his brother Mike serves as chairman of the board. Roberts has also served on the board of directors of Pulaski Financial Corporation, an independent, community-based bank based in St. Louis, since 2006.

Roberts is married to Eva Frazer, M.D.; the couple has three children.

Accession Number

A2007.294

Sex

Male

Interview Date

10/18/2007

12/7/2007

Last Name

Roberts

Maker Category

BusinessMakers

PoliticalMakers

Middle Name

Occupation

Entrepreneur

City Alderman

Organizations

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Schools

Scullin Elementary School

Northwest High School

Clark University

Washington University School of Law

First Name

Steven

Birth City, State, Country

St. Louis

HM ID

ROB19

Favorite Season

Fall

State

Missouri

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2007.294.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/543488

Favorite Vacation Destination

San Diego, California; Nassau, Bahamas

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

Missouri

Interview Description

A2007_294_EAD.pdf

A2007_294_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

4/11/1952

Birth Place Term

St. Louis

Speakers Bureau Region City

St. Louis

Country

USA

Short Description

Entrepreneur and city alderman Steven Roberts, Sr. (1952 - ) was a St. Louis alderman who, along with his brother, Michael Roberts, Sr., founded The Roberts Companies. Roberts served as the company's president, as well as a board member for the Pulaski Financial Corporation of St. Louis.

Employment

St. Louis Board of Aldermen

The Roberts Companies

Favorite Color

Maroon, White

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/543507

Timing Pairs

0,0:8064,211:10152,324:12744,387:13032,392:16272,440:16848,449:18072,494:25626,578:26194,587:32868,746:33152,751:33862,763:35424,826:58232,1193:62201,1274:62606,1280:66008,1335:71432,1361:77831,1491:79613,1534:98434,1825:99910,1856:109340,2035:110898,2064:111718,2075:114506,2134:132866,2397:133310,2404:146172,2550:151860,2737:152148,2742:152796,2796:155820,2878:156108,2883:159420,2947:173838,3184:175944,3233:192154,3468:193450,3495:197986,3605:199426,3636:211420,3759$0,0:1664,32:5888,187:6464,197:10048,257:10432,264:15168,370:15424,375:16768,398:17024,403:24500,453:27930,542:28630,553:31080,598:31850,612:52503,996:52779,1001:123538,2108:127534,2197:128422,2212:131604,2258:138368,2307:139204,2324:139964,2337:143004,2394:143308,2399:147868,2465:151440,2514:155544,2570:156988,2592:167884,2695:168152,2700:170095,2736:178220,2863

DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Steven Roberts, Sr.'s interview, session 1

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his maternal grandfather's ancestry

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his maternal grandmother's ancestry

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers his maternal great-grandfather

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about the history of St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his mother's community in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about his mother's upbringing

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the early years of his parents' marriage

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers his parents' catering business

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his upbringing

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls auditioning at the Orpheum Theatre in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his mother's teaching career

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his paternal grandmother's ancestry, pt. 1

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his paternal grandmother's ancestry, pt. 2

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his father's maternal relatives

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his paternal grandfather's ancestry

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes how his paternal grandparents met

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his paternal family's move to St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his father's upbringing

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his father's service in the U.S. military

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his father's contribution to The Roberts Companies

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his likeness to his parents

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his earliest childhood memories

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls moving to San Francisco Court in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood, pt. 1

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the tourism industry in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his early childhood in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the San Francisco Court community in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers Scullin Elementary School in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his early experiences of racial discrimination

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his classmates at Scullin Elementary School

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his teachers at Scullin Elementary School

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes Northwest High School in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his activities at Northwest High School

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls the assassination of Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his early civil rights activities

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about the St. Louis Public Schools

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers the civil rights groups in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the Veiled Prophet Organization, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers the Veiled Prophet Fair

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the Veiled Prophet Organization, pt. 2

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the American Youth Foundation camps, pt. 1

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the American Youth Foundation camps, pt. 2

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his experiences at Camp Miniwanca in Shelby, Michigan

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his interest in universities on the East Coast

Tape: 6 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about D'Army Bailey

Tape: 6 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls matriculating at Clark University in Worcester, Massachusetts

Tape: 6 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers studying abroad in Ghana

Tape: 6 Story: 9 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers his studies at Clark University in Worcester, Massachusetts

Tape: 7 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his brother's interest in seminary school

Tape: 7 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his religious background

Tape: 7 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his relationship with his brother

Tape: 7 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his time at Clark University in Worcester, Massachusetts

Tape: 7 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his decision to attend law school

Tape: 7 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls his admission to the Washington University School of Law in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 7 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers the Washington University School of Law, pt. 1

Tape: 7 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. remembers the Washington University School of Law, pt. 2

Tape: 8 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his connection to Clarence Thomas

Tape: 8 Story: 2 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about Clarence Thomas and Alan Keyes

Tape: 8 Story: 3 - Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his networking opportunities

Tape: 8 Story: 4 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his early work for the St. Louis Board of Aldermen

Tape: 8 Story: 5 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the structure of the St. Louis City Council

Tape: 8 Story: 6 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his experiences as an alderman in St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 8 Story: 7 - Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his service on the St. Louis Board of Aldermen

Tape: 8 Story: 8 - Steven Roberts, Sr. talks about the mayors of St. Louis, Missouri

Tape: 8 Story: 9 - Steven Roberts, Sr. describes the founding of Roberts-Roberts and Associates

Tape: 8 Story: 10 - Steven Roberts, Sr. recalls applying for a license from the Federal Communications Commission

Tape: 9 Story: 1 - Steven Roberts, Sr. narrates his photographs

DASession

2$2

DATape

6$8

DAStory

4$6

DATitle

Steven Roberts, Sr. reflects upon his experiences at Camp Miniwanca in Shelby, Michigan

Steven Roberts, Sr. describes his experiences as an alderman in St. Louis, Missouri

Transcript

And for us, you know, we had always heard of the Danforth family because they were prominent, Danforth Foundation [St. Louis, Missouri], and Bill Danforth [William H. Danforth] was about to become chancellor of Washington University [Washington University in St. Louis, St. Louis, Missouri], he was there for twenty years. Jack Danforth [John Danforth] became a U.S. senator, you know, vice presidential candidate. He at the time was the attorney general [of Missouri], so, I mean, you know, these are names that you, you, we'd hear about all of the time, but now we're there speaking with them because they were obviously very interested in their grandfather's camp. They would just be walking around the grounds. So for us it kind of broke down barriers in terms of our ability to be approachable to whomever, I mean if it's a president or a king or a queen or a state senator.$$Now, were there many other black kids there?$$Not many. And, and part of Mike's [HistoryMaker Michael Roberts, Sr.] challenge and I picked it up after he finished his four years were to and, and, and the foundation understood the need to have more people of color there because they knew that the world was changing and they had to have a more diverse campground for their kids to have a truly unique experience. So Mike would go out, in fact, the reason why I was there is because he recruited me and he found a few other kids in St. Louis [Missouri] that I knew to come. And remember, you know, for a black parent to send their kid off for two weeks to this camp [Camp Miniwanca] in Michigan [Shelby, Michigan] was difficult for a couple of reasons, one is it was something outside of their sphere, sphere of understanding. But two, a lot of kids worked during the summer so how you gonna send, you know, how, how you gone go and not work during the summer for two weeks. So it was, it was kind of a challenge for us to encourage parents to allow their kids to go up there. But every child that I know went up there, and there're maybe a few exceptions, particularly the leadership program, absolutely love it. And, in fact, I have sent my children there. In fact, Mike and I have sponsored scholarships to send other African American kids there just like we were on scholarship. And so my older son [Steven Roberts, Jr.] who's in college, my high school son [Christian Roberts] now, he'll finish his fourth year, and, you know, my hope is that my daughter [Darci Roberts] will go up there too. I've got two nephews who's been there, all of Mike's kids have been there because it, it just gives you a different set of leadership skills that other, you don't get any other places, in a beautiful setting.$$Okay.$$Yeah.$$So you were there in high school [Northwest High School, St. Louis, Missouri]?$$High school, yeah, yeah, and then--$$Did you go for four years?$$Yeah, I went for four years. And, in fact, I even went back one summer when I was in college [Clark University, Worcester, Massachusetts] to be a counselor in the, what they call the younger boys program that's the typical fourth through eighth grades so I spent about six weeks up there, you know, being a camp counselor which was, you know, kind of hard but it was fun because of the, you know, I was getting paid and getting fed and it was a beautiful atmosphere. And then I went back and, and, I took my boys when they were very little to a family, they have family camp too where you can take young, young kids up and then you just kind of do fun things. And then I became on the board of the American Youth Foundation.$$Okay.$$So, you know, we're, we're keeping the legacy in terms of encouraging, you know, a diversity of the camp experience for, because of having diversity there.$$Okay.$So my job that last year of law school [Washington University School of Law, St. Louis, Missouri] and then the year after that was I was, what they call the fiscal, well, first I was the assistant clerk, which basically I helped prepare legislation for our weekly meetings and committee meetings. So for me still being in school, I could do what I needed to do and not miss classes. And then the next year I was asked to serve as the executive to the president of the board, so I basically ran his office for the most part because he was a practicing attorney and it wasn't a full-time job. And also the, the fiscal analyst, so I was the one who would help prepare the budgets for the Board of Aldermen, but, but I would also review the board, the budgets of all the other city departments because remember, you had the mayor, the comptroller and the president of the board would all sit on a weekly basis determining which contracts to sign and they ultimately was the body that approved the city budget. So for me, now remember I am one year out of law school, I'm sitting there with the mayor, the comptroller, and the president of the Board of Aldermen, you know. I'm, I'm holding hearings on, for my boss, for the, the director of streets, community development, parks, so I got to know all these people, you know, for those two years. So by the time I ran for the Board of Aldermen in 1979, two years later, I then knew everybody. So, so when I'd come in and, you know, Mrs. Smith in the 4900 block of Wabada [Avenue] is complaining because her tree limbs were falling out on the street and they couldn't get out, or, or, or there are potholes in their alley or whatever, I just would pick up the phone--. Now, of course, I'm an aldermen now so they're gonna respond anyway but I'd call directly to the director of streets and say, you know, this guy is named Jim Shay at the time, I'd say, "Jim, I've got a problem here and such and such--." He said, "Okay," you know, "alderman, I'll take care of that tomorrow," 'cause I knew him and, you know, it wasn't like having to submit a request in writing to them and hopefully they put it on a list and got it done. So I will tell you that those two years of experience were probably as valu- in city government were as valuable as certainly my three and a half years of law school because with the master's degree it usually takes four years, I did it in three and a half years, was more valuable than anything I've done in, in, in all of my multiple careers here because it taught me, one, how bureaucracy worked basically. It also taught me how important it is to have interpersonal relationships with folks. I mean, you can go tell people what to do all the time, the question is will they do it. When you're in city government it's gotta be a cooperative effort or you never get anything done.

Read more about Steven Roberts, Sr.

Robert Lewis Harris

Lawyer, activist, and business executive Robert Lewis Harris was born to Lucy and Benjamin Harris on March 4, 1944, in Arkadelphia, Arkansas. After moving to California in 1960, Harris, a 1961 graduate of Oakland Technical High School, received his A.A. degree from Merritt College in Oakland in 1963 and his B.A. degree from San Francisco State University in 1965 (in 2007 he was inducted into the university’s Hall of Fame). Harris worked as a probation officer for four years before entering the University of California Berkeley Law School (Boalt Hall). Shortly after Harris’s receipt of his J.D. degree in 1972, he joined the legal staff at Pacific Gas & Electric Co. (PG&E) where he spent thirty-four years as an attorney and business executive, retiring in January 2007.

In 1973, Harris became active with his local bar associations, serving in 1976 as President of the Charles Houston Bar Association (CHBA), an association of Black lawyers in Northern California. He made a name for himself in the legal community by leading a team of Black lawyers who successfully defended the NAACP against libel and slander charges in 1978. A year later, he made history by becoming the first lawyer from the West Coast to ever serve as President of the National Bar Association (NBA). A Founder of the California Association of Black Lawyers in 1977, Harris in 1982 served as a founding member of the board of the National Bar Institute, the funding component of the NBA. Later that year, he became the first President of the Wiley Manuel Law Foundation, the funding component of CHBA. In 1983, he became Chairman of the Legal Redress Committee of Oakland branch of the NAACP, and in 1986, he received the NAACP’s highest legal honor, the W. Robert Ming Award for his advocacy on behalf of the NAACP. Harris has also received the highest honors of Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity (Laurel Wreath Award) and the NBA (C. Francis Stradford Award).

In 1985, Harris argued and won a landmark corporate free speech case in the U.S. Supreme Court protecting PG&E’s First Amendment rights. In 1987, Harris married Glenda Newell, with whom he had two children. After completing the Harvard Business School’s Advance Management Program in 1988, he began his ascension through the corporate ranks at PG&E, first as Vice President of Community Relations and later as Vice President of Environmental Affairs. In the latter position, Harris expanded and led PG&E’s environmental stewardship endeavors to a new level. Harris has continued his involvement in community issues by serving in the highest ranking positions in Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity (Grand Polemarch) and in Sigma Pi Phi Fraternity (the Boulé) as Grand Sire Archon-Elect; serving on the board of the Port of Oakland; being involved with the United Negro College Fund of the Bay Area; working with the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights of the San Francisco Bay Area (Co-Chair); working with the California League of Conservation Voters; working with the American Association of Blacks in Energy (General Counsel); being involved with the African American Experience Fund of the National Parks Foundation; serving on the U.S. EPA National Environmental Justice Advisory Council; working with the California EPA Environmental Justice Advisory Committee; serving on the National Environmental Policy Commission; and being involved with the Oakland African American Chamber of Commerce, among many others.

Accession Number

A2007.195

Sex

Male

Interview Date

7/6/2007

Last Name

Harris

Maker Category

LawMakers

Middle Name

Lewis

Occupation

Energy Executive

Civil Rights Lawyer

Corporate Lawyer

Organizations

Sigma Pi Phi Fraternity (Boule)

California Law Review

Charles Houston Bar Association

Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

National Bar Association

National Bar Institute

Wiley W. Manuel Bar Association of Sacramento County

Schools

Williams Elementary School

Peake High School

Oakland Technical High School

Merritt College

San Francisco State University

University of California, Berkeley School of Law

Harvard Business School

First Name

Robert

Birth City, State, Country

Arkadelphia

HM ID

HAR25

Favorite Season

Christmas

State

Arkansas

THM DA Link

http://marc.thehistorymakers.org/thmdigital/A2007.195.htm

Web Clip 1

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/570727

Favorite Vacation Destination

Bahamas

Favorite Quote

If You Have No Confidence In Self, You're Twice Defeated In The Race Of Life. With Confidence, You Have Won Before You Even Started.

Bio Photo

Speakers Bureau Region State

New York

Interview Description

A2007_195_EAD.pdf

A2007_195_EAC.pdf

Birth Date

3/4/1944

Birth Place Term

Arkadelphia

Speakers Bureau Region City

Ithaca

Country

USA

Favorite Food

Fried Chicken

Short Description

Energy executive and civil rights lawyer Robert Lewis Harris (1944 - ) worked for the Pacific Gas & Electric Company for over three decades. Throughout his career in the legal profession, Harris was involved with a wide variety of free speech, environmental, and community advocacy issues.

Employment

Alameda County Probation Department

Pacifica Police Department

Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Favorite Color

Red

Web Clip 2

https://thmdaprodmedia.blob.core.windows.net/media/story/video/570747

Timing Pairs

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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Robert Lewis Harris' interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his father's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris lists his siblings

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers the Williams School in Arkadelphia, Arkansas

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his father's start as a minister

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his early personality

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers the influence of his elementary school teacher

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the community of Arkadelphia, Arkansas

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about his father's churches in Arkansas

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers Peake High School in Arkadelphia, Arkansas

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls his teachers and classmates at Peake High School

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his decision to move to California

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers school integration in Arkansas

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers his move to Oakland, California

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the student body of Oakland Technical High School in Oakland, California

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers enrolling in classes at Oakland Technical High School

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his experiences at Oakland Technical High School in Oakland, California

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his experiences at Oakland Junior College

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the demographics of Oakland, California

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers transferring to San Francisco State College in San Francisco, California

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his role as an officer of the Alameda County Probation Department

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the juvenile probation system in Alameda County, California

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his decision to attend law school

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the culture of the San Francisco Bay Area

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls his first year at the University of California Berkeley School of Law

Tape: 3 Story: 10 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his experiences at the University of California Berkeley School of Law

Tape: 3 Story: 11 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about his position on the California Law Review

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls his second year at the University of California Berkeley School of Law

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers his summer work experiences during law school

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls joining the legal department of the Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers Frederick Searls and Richard Clarke

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls his first legal case at the Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his first legal case on corporate free speech

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the case of Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris describes Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California, pt. 2

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers the decision of Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the energy crisis

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his legal work for the NAACP

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls how he was chosen to argue the case of Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the precedent set by Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the Charles Houston Bar Association

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris describes the creation of the Charles Houston Bar Association Foundation, Inc.

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers Benjamin Travis

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the Kappa Alpha Psi Fraternity

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris remembers Earl B. Dickerson

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about his time management skills

Tape: 6 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his role in the National Bar Association

Tape: 6 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the past presidents of the National Bar Association

Tape: 7 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the history of the National Bar Association

Tape: 7 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his role in funding African American bar associations

Tape: 7 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris reflects upon his leadership skills

Tape: 7 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his concerns for African American organizations

Tape: 7 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls the history of Sigma Pi Phi Fraternity

Tape: 7 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about W.E.B. Du Bois' involvement with the Boule

Tape: 7 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris reflects upon the state of education in the African American community

Tape: 7 Story: 8 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his transition to the operating division of the Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Tape: 8 Story: 1 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his role as the central division manager of the Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Tape: 8 Story: 2 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls the Oakland firestorm of 1991, pt. 1

Tape: 8 Story: 3 - Robert Lewis Harris recalls the Oakland firestorm of 1991, pt. 2

Tape: 8 Story: 4 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the contamination of the water supply in Hinkley, California

Tape: 8 Story: 5 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his career at the Pacific Gas and Electric Company

Tape: 8 Story: 6 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about the blackouts of 2001 in California

Tape: 8 Story: 7 - Robert Lewis Harris talks about his family

Tape: 8 Story: 8 - Robert Lewis Harris describes how he would like to be remembered

Tape: 8 Story: 9 - Robert Lewis Harris describes his hopes and concerns for the African American community

Tape: 8 Story: 10 - Robert Lewis Harris reflects upon the importance of history

DASession

1$1

DATape

2$5

DAStory

8$2

DATitle

Robert Lewis Harris remembers enrolling in classes at Oakland Technical High School

Robert Lewis Harris remembers the decision of Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California

Transcript

Was that difficult though, that being your senior year, I mean besides the--you know, 'cause it's all new. You--$$Yeah, it was quite different. I--you have to go to your counselor and get your classes. So I went to the counselor, a person I'll never forget as long as I live. Her name was Mrs. Hillegas, H-I-L-L-E-G-A-S [Miriam Hillegas], and saw all the courses that could be taken. And you had choices between college prep and non-college prep, what they call workshop and all that other stuff. And of course, having believed all along that I was bright and would go to college, so I signed up for all college prep courses and gave her the slip.$$And, and so that worked out--$$No.$$Okay.$$She properly denied it (laughter).$$So tell me what happened. Let's talk about--$$Well, she was very kind. She looked at it, and I recall she looked back up at me like I wonder what's his problem. And either I brought with me or had my transcript from my prior--or my grades. It was my grades from my eleventh grade, having been finished eleventh grade at Peake High School [Arkadelphia, Arkansas]. And I presented those to her, which was essentially an A minus average, and she sort of frowned and smiled at the same time, as though this poor kid doesn't know. And she said, "We can't enroll you in college prep courses." "You can't enroll me in college prep courses?" She said, "No. You wouldn't be able to compete because you're coming from this school," and, she was trying to be helpful, I guess, "in Arkansas, and the kids in college prep are very smart students, and you just wouldn't be able to keep up with them." And I did not believe that. I, I mean, I just couldn't believe it. It was the first time in my life anybody had ever told me that I could not compete educationally. I'd never heard that concept before. And of course, she was the first white teacher, or counselor, that I had ever seen face to face. So, that was disappointing obviously. And I went back home that evening and gave the news to my sister [Jean Harris Blacksher], who went berserk and insisted that the next day that her husband, Artis [Artis Blacksher], who is 6'5", at that time at least 250 plus [pounds], today a little bit larger, who was instructed by her to go with me back to school. And Artis was high school graduation, truck driver; he was a member of the Teamsters [International Brotherhood of Teamsters]. And he went back with me the next morning to school to see Mrs. Hillegas. And I will always remember that morning because he was not diplomatic. He just went in and started raving at her. And of course, it scared the hell out of her, and she just said any course he wants he gets, any course he want and just, you know, like get out of here. This man is crazy (laughter). And so she signed, and I was able to get all of my college prep courses. And then I went to those courses, which was odd to me. I'd never seen this before, coming from an integrated--a segregated school into my first class in an integrated school. It looked--I'd seen black students at school, and population was about 10 percent or so, so you seen them. But when I got in the class, I think in any class I didn't see more than one black student outside of myself, and I thought that was strange. But then it dawned on me, ultimately, wait a minute; those students probably went through the same thing that I went through that my brother-in-law just went berserk on, and they weren't into the college prep courses because of the belief that they could not compete. And so I, in, in, at Oakland Tech [Oakland Technical High School, Oakland, California] I was usually one or two, three at the most, of blacks students in any of those college prep courses.$So describe the experience and the result.$$The experience was great. It never dawned on me that I was gonna lose the case [Pacific Gas and Electric Company v. Public Utilities Commission of California, 1986]. I was convinced that I would win, and I was convinced--and some people say you were lucky; it was you were cocky, or whatever. I had done so much research on every single justice, how they think, what they wrote about the subject, and even before I argued the case, I had predicted who would vote for it and who would vote against it, who would be in my favor and who would not be in my favor. As the appellate, we had lost in California, so we had to go first, and so I went. The, if you look at the transcript, the first question asked of me was from Justice Rehnquist [William Rehnquist], who was not the chief justice at the time because Burger [Warren E. Burger] was. Rehnquist, with his bad back, leans up and say, "Mr. Harris [HistoryMaker Robert Lewis Harris], where did you get this notion that a corporation, like an individual, is entitled to negative First Amendment rights, the right not to speak? We know we've granted them the right to speak, but going so far as giving them right not to speak is, you know, somehow absurd." I smiled. I said, "I got it from Justice Powell [Lewis F. Powell, Jr.], of course," (laughter), and then went on to explain why. And Justice Powell is just sitting there grinning. I knew then he would write the, the, the opinion, and he did write the opinion. The, the, the other justices, with the exception of Marshall [Thurgood Marshall], was pretty much engaged in the--Marshall didn't ask a single question. But they were really engaged in it, the (unclear). As you look at the news articles, all you see is Associated Press said it was one of the most animated [U.S.] Supreme Court arguments in long time before the Supreme Court. I needed, in particular, Sandra Day O'Connor, who was the first woman on the Supreme Court and hadn't been there too long. I knew I needed her vote, and I became convinced I had it when my opponent came up to argue, said I'll go first; he came second. And when she started cross examining him and calling him by my name, I said ah, I must have made a hell of an impression. And I knew he was in trouble, and primary because of the questions that she was asking of him, and he couldn't really respond. So I figured I had her vote as well, so I--and I, and I knew I had Marshall and Brennan [William J. Brennan, Jr.] because of the way that I had argued the case and had set out the briefs, so that government--and, and this shocked a lot of people. A lot of the corporate lawyers and so called experts in constitutional law--you notice I said so called--they knew Brennan and Marshall, the two most liberal justices, would never vote for a corporation. They're, they're probably right if you framed it that way. But I framed the, the issue that they had to answer the question whether or not you were gonna allow government to pick and choose who can speak. Because the only way you can enforce this statute or this order, since the envelope is very tiny, and only so many voices can be heard, which means that the state has to decide who speaks this month, who speaks next month. And then I just, just had fun quoting Brennan and Marshall the case after case after case where they said government has no business picking and choosing who can speak. And the only way that you can rule in favor of the state in this instance is for the state to pick and choose who speaks (laughter). And that was absolutely correct. And, and, and that was what the fatal flaw that most constitutional lawyers didn't quite understand, that Brennan and Marshall were tied to that notion; they were consistent. They couldn't now say, "Well, if it's a corporation, the state can pick and choose." No, they have been consistent. They don't want government picking and choosing who can speak, and you shouldn't. And, and the other thing I said, you--, "If free speech is about free speech, you really shouldn't have to decide," and if you look in the transcript, you'll see this, "you have to look and see who's speaking to determine whether or not that speech is permissible." Speech is a permissible or it is not. So you don't need to look and say oh, that's John Jones speaking; oh no, that's a corporation speaking. You're gonna let John Jones speak but not the corporation. So anyway, they brought in a 5-4, 5-3 decision. Justice Blackmun [Harry Blackmun] recused himself apparently because he owned utilities stock, because when the case was called, he got up and walked out. The opinion was written by Justice Powell and concurred in by Marshall, Brennan, Sandra Day O'Connor, and the chief justice, not Rehnquist, of course, but Burger.$$Now how much time passed between your argument and the decision?$$It was October the 8th [1985]; the decision came out in February [1986].

Read more about Robert Lewis Harris

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