The Nation’s Largest African American Video Oral History Collection Mobile search icon Mobile close search icon
Advanced Biography Search
Mobile navigation icon Close mobile navigation icon

Frank Dale Morgan

Geophysicist and professor F. Dale Morgan was born in Guyana in South America. Morgan also grew up in Guyana where he attended St. Stanislaus’ College. He attended St. Joseph’s College and the Polytechnic Institute in Trinidad. In 1970, Morgan earned his B.S. degrees in mathematics and physics from the University of the West Indies, Trinidad and Tobago. He then continued his studies at the University of the West Indies, where he earned his M.S. degree in theoretical solid state physics in 1972. His thesis was entitled: “Symmetry properties and dispersion relations in antiferromagnetic NiO and CoO.”

Morgan served as a lecturer in the physics department of the University of the West Indies until 1975, when he began attending the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) with the assistance of a joint Organization of American States (OAS)/Trinidad Government Scholarship. In 1981, he graduated from the Department of Earth and Planetary Sciences at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. His Ph.D. degree was awarded for his thesis: “Electronics of sulfide minerals: implications for induced polarization.” Upon the completion of his degree, Morgan began work as a faculty member at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology. He then became a full professor of geophysics and the associate director of the Earth Resources Laboratory. Morgan’s interests include geoelectromagnetism, electrokinetics, applied seismology and environmental geophysics.

In 2005, Morgan was named the co-director of the Kuwait-MIT Center for Natural Resources and the Environment, a group that aims to promote research and education outreach in the areas of energy, water, and the environment. Morgan is responsible for several projects concerning the human use and the quality of water. The projects involve investigation of oilfield production brines and the injection of treated wastewater into natural groundwater aquifers. Morgan has served on a number of advisory committees and has published many academic papers in the field of geophysics. Morgan is married to Alison Morgan.

Accession Number

A2012.237

Sex

Male

Interview Date

10/10/2012

Last Name

Morgan

Maker Category
Marital Status

Married

Middle Name

Dale

Occupation
Organizations
Schools

University of the West Indies, Trinidad and Tobago

Massachusetts Institute of Technology

Search Occupation Category
First Name

Frank

HM ID

MOR12

Favorite Season

Summer

Favorite Vacation Destination

Curacao, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, Cyprus

Favorite Quote

Focus.

Bio Photo
Speakers Bureau Region State

Massachusetts

Birth Date

5/14/1947

Speakers Bureau Region City

Boston

Country

Guyana

Favorite Food

Curry

Short Description

Geophysicist Frank Dale Morgan (1947 - ) is known for his field work in seismic research, particularly in the Caribbean and Kuwait.

Employment

University of the West Indies, Trinidad and Tobago

Seismic Research Centre of the University of the West Indies

Stanford University

Texas A&M University

Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)

Favorite Color

Red

Timing Pairs
0,0:1884,20:2379,27:6082,40:6298,45:6892,57:7270,66:16530,175:22790,219:23210,226:23910,238:39310,385:40075,399:40755,408:49886,483:50230,488:54634,537:76670,826:78004,856:94962,1108:101439,1152:102024,1158:105040,1169:105950,1181:109279,1215:109563,1220:110273,1232:128319,1431:131438,1461:134970,1497:135666,1506:136275,1514:137260,1519:137560,1525:156400,1778:156802,1785:157941,1805:158276,1811:160420,1859:165836,1930:167348,2055:170452,2093:171200,2112:174795,2157:178660,2226:179360,2239:181000,2253$0,0:7872,132:8204,137:23122,291:23714,300:24232,309:27475,339:29246,368:30170,383:33186,419:34226,449:38716,498:39296,511:39702,519:48580,614:53200,629:54124,643:56973,692:61888,719:64940,734:65318,742:66722,774:66938,779:68320,786:72820,815:75342,831:75864,838:76734,850:78790,864:81286,880:81638,885:83306,895:88250,951:89100,959:89525,965:92770,986:94318,1007:94748,1013:95264,1020:95694,1026:97762,1052:98196,1062:98444,1068:98754,1074:100735,1090:102248,1109:115854,1347:116214,1353:117294,1384:122116,1416:125836,1500:129060,1524:129360,1531:130510,1559:132675,1571:133050,1578:133425,1584:134100,1597:134850,1614:135450,1624:136425,1646:137025,1656:137700,1668:141950,1705:142530,1717:145488,1768:146124,1783:146389,1789:148172,1802:148684,1811:149644,1829:150284,1845:150604,1851:150988,1859:151628,1871:155340,1957:157836,2013:158284,2025:163214,2058:163502,2066:165824,2093:168400,2139:173351,2179:173586,2185:173774,2190:174338,2205:174996,2217:175842,2243:176265,2257:176829,2271:183440,2374
DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Frank Dale Morgan's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his maternal grandparents

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his mother's brilliance and her employment

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his father's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his parents' school

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his parents' personalities

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his sisters

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his earliest childhood memory

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his identity as a Trinidadian, and talks about his childhood friend, Bernard Freeman

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan describes the sights, sounds and smells of growing up in Guyana

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his trek through the Amazon jungle, from Guyana to Brazil - part one

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his trek through the Amazon jungle, from Guyana to Brazil - part two

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about the schools that he attended in Guyana

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about the lessons that he has learned from his grandparents

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about moving from Guyana to Trinidad in 1961

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about the steel band scene in Trinidad in the 1960s

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his experience in St. Joseph's College in Trinidad, and his return to St. Stanislaus College in Guyana

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his last year of high school at Saint Stanislaus College, Guyana

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his mentors, Father Lynch and Professor Ted Madden, and his entry into university in Trinidad

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his experience at the University of West Indies in Trinidad

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his mentors at the University of West Indies in Trinidad and Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his decision to change directions from theoretical solid state physics to geophysics

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his decision to pursue a Ph.D. degree in geophysics at Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his doctoral advisor at MIT, Professor Theodore Madden

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his approach to completing his doctoral thesis at MIT

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan describes the high caliber of research and researchers at MIT

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his doctoral dissertation research in electrochemistry, at MIT

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his groundbreaking research on how earthquakes start and on how to predict earthquakes

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his work with the seismic research unit at the University of West Indies in Trinidad

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his involvement in predicting earthquakes in Tobago, in 1982 and 1998

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his decision to accept faculty positions at Stanford University and Texas A&M University

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his decision to return to Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) as a full professor of geophysics

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his research and experience as a professor of geophysics at MIT

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his involvement in the Eastern Caribbean Geothermal Energy Project

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about the island of Montserrat and his work on finding potable water sources in St. Lucia

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Frank Dale Morgan reflects upon his legacy

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his interest in future educational initiatives

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about the deficiencies in the American education system

Tape: 6 Story: 6 - Frank Dale Morgan reflects upon his career

Tape: 6 Story: 7 - Frank Dale Morgan describes his hopes and concerns for the African American community

Tape: 6 Story: 8 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about his family

Tape: 6 Story: 9 - Frank Dale Morgan talks about how he would like to be remembered

DASession

1$1

DATape

4$5

DAStory

6$1

DATitle
Frank Dale Morgan describes his groundbreaking research on how earthquakes start and on how to predict earthquakes
Frank Dale Morgan describes his work with the seismic research unit at the University of West Indies in Trinidad
Transcript
What is interesting today, probably the most interesting piece of research I'm doing now, and arguably, maybe it's going to be the most interesting I'll do in my life, is the question of how earthquakes begin. And the second question to that is, if you understand how they begin, maybe you will find a way of predicting--and of course, that's a big societal plus if you can do that. Well, I think everyone agrees today who look at the earthquake source, prior to an event, that by some means, the pressure of the water in the pores is increasing. Now, you see, you can take any rock, any material, if you increase that pressure in the pores, what's gonna happen? The rock kind of explodes just from the pressure. So, it weakens it. So, everyone agrees, but no one agrees how this pressure is increasing, and they've got some really harebrained ideas that water is pumping underground from ten kilometers away, and all kinds of crazy stuff. But I'm writing a paper today. I don't know where I'll go as yet, whether to 'Nature' or 'Science' [prominent scientific journals], and it is probably over two decades in the making. But it's to show in great detail the physics and chemistry of a method that causes this pressure to increase. And it turns out to be mostly due to chemistry, but very, very, very, simple. And you know, sometimes when you're right, when you see it's so simple, you know you got it right. And this chemistry is ubiquitous, it's everywhere in the earth. And so, I strongly believe that we're gonna come up, or I have come up with a good way of explaining how these earthquakes begin. But, you see, most of us are seismologists, if I put on my seismology hat, I think of an earthquake as a mechanical thing. So, I look at mechanical ways. But what's happening is at the micro level, the mechanics is being influenced by the chemistry. And you see, again, how funny it is. It makes a full loop back to my professor [Morgan's doctoral advisor at Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT)], Ted Madden, who said "Learn chemistry." It wouldn't have been my choice. It wasn't what I was good in. But the fact he made me into a world-class electro-chemist, I can now look at the earthquake problem in a different way.$So, 1975, after, when you finished your Ph.D., you went back. Well, you finished in '81 [1981], I'm sorry, '81 [1981].$$Yeah.$$You went back to the University of West Indies [Trinidad].$$I did, yes.$$Okay. And you taught geophysics or--$$I did teach geophysics. But I worked in, mainly a research unit for seismology. We monitored the volcanoes and the earthquake centers in the Caribbean. So, it gave me a lot of chance to travel along to the Caribbean, and get to know it better. But I did teach in the physics department then and, well, in many departments in mathematics and petroleum engineering and so forth. It was something I'm kind of proud of. If we, in fact go back before that to 1972--$$Okay.$$--I started in the physics department at the University of West Indies with two other colleagues, a program for the senior students in environmental geophysics. At that time, the environmental word was not a buzz word at all. And the program still runs up to today and graduating thirty to forty people every year. So, I'm very proud that, you know, forty years ago I was instrumental, as a very young person then. I was only, you know, twenty-four or twenty-five years old when we did this. We had even a lot of objection, why you calling this thing "environmental" and so forth, you know, whereas today, nobody would ask you those questions.$$Well, what was the inspiration in those days?$$You know, basically, again, it might, you know, go back to my younger life. I realized that there are a lot of things that geophysics can do, you know. It's such a broad subject, you know. You could study the atmosphere, you could study the oceans, you know, the earthquakes. You could go looking for minerals, for pollution. And so we put together a program in all those pieces. The students taking it learn a piece of all of those things, looking for water and so forth. We call it environmental--. And there's some field work and lab work, environmental geophysics. It's still going up to today. So, when I went back in 1981, I went back to teaching some of that, you know, having started it, and glad to say it's still functioning. And the other major thing that happened in my years there before I came back to the U.S., was the prediction of these two earthquakes in Tobago. That happened while I was working at the seismic research unit, yeah.

Waverly Person

Geophysicist and seismologist Waverly Person was born in Blackridge, Virginia on May 1, 1926 to Bessie Butts and Santee Person. Person grew up as the third of twelve children and helped on the family farm. For high school, he attended the Saint Paul Normal and Industrial School, the high school associated with the historically black Saint Paul's College in Lawrenceville, Virginia. In 1944, he was drafted into the U.S. Army as a high school senior, and Person served in the Pacific during World War II and in the Korean War. In the Army, he was promoted seven times to achieve the rank of first sergeant and received the Good Conduct Medal and the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal. After his honorable discharge in 1951, he returned to Saint Paul's College and received his B.S. degree in mathematics. Person met Sarah Walker during college and they married in 1954.

He worked as a physical science technician for the Department of Agriculture before being transferred to the Department of Commerce as a seismic monitoring technician. Person became interested in geophysics while he was working and started attending American University and George Washington University. Person became a qualified geophysicist in 1965, but he remained a technician due to racism. He was finally hired as a federal geophysicist and he transferred to the United States Geological Survey's National Earthquake Information Center in Golden, Colorado in 1971. Person worked his way up and became the first African American chief scientist in 1977, where he remained until his retirement in 2006.

Person is often sought out by national and international media as an earthquake spokesperson. Person has received an honorary doctorate in science from St. Paul's College, the Outstanding Government Communicator Award, the Meritorious Service Award from the United States Department of the Interior, and the Annual Minority Award from the Community Services Department in Boulder, Colorado. He has been active with the Seismological Society of America, Boulder County Crimestoppers, and Flatirons Kiwanis Club.

Waverly Person was interviewed by the The HistoryMakers on June 19, 2002.

Accession Number

A2002.119

Sex

Male

Interview Date

6/19/2002

Last Name

Person

Maker Category
Occupation
Organizations
Search Occupation Category
Speakers Bureau

Yes

First Name

Waverly

Birth City, State, Country

Blackridge

HM ID

PER01

Speakers Bureau Honorarium

No

Favorite Season

Spring

Sponsor

Knight Foundation

State

Virginia

Favorite Vacation Destination

None

Favorite Quote

Keep Getting Up.

Bio Photo
Speakers Bureau Region State

Colorado

Birth Date

5/1/1926

Birth Place Term
Speakers Bureau Region City

Denver

Country

United States

Favorite Food

Steak, Yams (Candied)

Short Description

Geophysicist Waverly Person (1926 - ) was the first African American to be the chief scientist at the National Earthquake Information Center for the United States Geological Survey in Golden, Colorado. Person was also renowned as an earthquake spokesperson for national and international media.

Employment

National Earthquake Information Center

Main Sponsor
Favorite Color

Brown

Timing Pairs
0,0:1646,14:7048,129:8216,166:11355,234:11647,239:15443,369:16173,401:22013,538:24349,577:24641,603:42358,781:48096,828:48522,835:49445,852:50297,866:50794,875:53563,931:86149,1442:91092,1487:91604,1497:91988,1504:94612,1572:98354,1606:99398,1622:102008,1659:102791,1670:103400,1679:116912,1884:117292,1914:121852,2008:124056,2052:124360,2057:125120,2070:125652,2081:126640,2095:127248,2110:127552,2115:136555,2265:137315,2277:138265,2313:141630,2361:142068,2369:146886,2463:157048,2574:157344,2579:157936,2591:160822,2639:161192,2645:173340,2798:173924,2803:176990,2860:177501,2868:179545,2915:179910,2921:182246,2965:189888,3053:190232,3058:191694,3075:192382,3098:195240,3106:195906,3160:198126,3216:198792,3226:199532,3238:213005,3371:216476,3410:220117,3421:220433,3426:220907,3433:221539,3443:229281,3593:239587,3746:246810,3809:248430,3831:253290,3914:261090,4042:261810,4056:262930,4079:272663,4218:275320,4237$0,0:7620,64:8700,74:11150,80:12434,96:14574,140:18747,201:22278,275:23348,284:23883,290:31788,333:32250,341:34983,355:35288,361:35898,372:36203,379:36752,391:37057,397:40107,469:40717,489:41388,513:42120,526:43279,562:44011,575:47747,618:55180,719:56630,730:57878,748:59970,758:60802,776:64050,790:64464,797:65154,817:65568,825:66327,837:66603,842:68811,886:73652,906:74116,911:76561,936:76866,942:77110,947:77415,953:77781,1015:79977,1050:81197,1084:81685,1095:81929,1100:84125,1163:84369,1168:84857,1178:85101,1183:86077,1207:86382,1213:97100,1315:99230,1330:99530,1335:101555,1375:103310,1380:104180,1404:104702,1415:108434,1476:108818,1484:109266,1494:109714,1503:109970,1508:110738,1521:111890,1553:112146,1558:112914,1571:113554,1582:114898,1613:116370,1641:116626,1646:123296,1712:124024,1720:124752,1728:125168,1733:126000,1743:126416,1748:142200,1969:142588,1974:143267,1983:145692,2025:155110,2170:167228,2385:168782,2410:170780,2453:171076,2458:174410,2500
DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Waverly Person's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Waverly Person shares his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Waverly Person talks about his parents and segregation

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Waverly Person talks about his father

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Waverly Person talks about the sights, sounds, and smells of his childhood

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Waverly Person talks about being innovative and about his grandparents

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Waverly Person talks about elementary school

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Waverly Person talks about his childhood personality

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Waverly Person talks about reading and his community

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Waverly Person talks about some childhood memories

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Waverly Person talks about his eleven siblings and deciding to attend high school

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Waverly Person talks about attending high school at Saint Paul's College

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Waverly Person talks about learning about the government and his civic actions to help blacks register to vote

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Waverly Person talks about his high school activities and being drafted into the Army

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Waverly Person talks about his Army training

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Waverly Person talks about his participation in the invasion of Japan at the end of World War II

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Waverly Person talks about the Korean War and Army integregation

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Waverly Person talks about going back to Saint Paul's College

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Waverly Person talks about starting work at the federal government

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Waverly Person talks about becoming a geophysicist, part 1

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Waverly Person talks about becoming a geophysicist, part 2

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Waverly Person talks about discrimination in the federal government

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Waverly Person talks about the United States Geological Survey (USGS) National Earthquake Information Service

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Waverly Person talks about earthquake magnitudes

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Waverly Person defines earthquake and fault and remembers some major earthquakes

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Waverly Person talks about science education and the difficulties of predicting earthquakes

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Waverly Person talks about the unique people who call the Earthquake Center

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Waverly Person talks about the United States Geological Survey and fighting for federal funding

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Waverly Person talks about the science in the black community

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Waverly Person talks about his wife and his legacy

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Waverly Person talks about how he would like to be remembered

DASession

1$1

DATape

3$5

DAStory

6$2

DATitle
Waverly Person talks about becoming a geophysicist, part 1
Waverly Person talks about the science in the black community
Transcript
So I had this background in math and science. I had a good background in math and science, and usually whatever I really set my mind to do, I could do it. So I was working in there, so I can remember the very day that I went there, they started me off and saying, you know, you got to interpret these seismograms. You got to change these records, and, you know, all that stuff. So kept looking at these things, and I said, all this recording here, recording earthquakes. And I said, what is all this stuff? I said I got to find out what this is. What are we recording? What are they doing? And they started talking about locating earthquakes, picking p-phase, picking s-phase and all that kind of stuff. And I said, well, I want to do this. And, you know, and so I'm a technician, I'm working there. I went back to school because I had my background in math and science, so I went back to American and Geo- Washington University [American University and George Washington University, Washington, District of Columbia], and I took all of the math and the science and everything you needed to become geophysicist, and I'm working there in it. And so I was developing more and more interest in it and everything. And I'm working the whole time. And I went on, went back and so I, I'm still a technician. And so I became qualified with everything that was needed to become a professional geophysicist, and I applied for it. The first couple of times I was turned down, not because I didn't qualify but because of my color. At that time, you had to put down what your race was. And so I got disqualified to even get on the register to be hired because my race was there, and I know what was going on. When they were doing the, the registering and, you know, looking at everything, well, automatically, I get disqualified because I'm black, okay. So I said, okay, I'm still working here, I'll keep working, and I kept working and everything. And then I kept applying. I kept applying. I'm getting experience all the time cause I had this project then that I was working on by myself, and at that time, they were building Flaming Gorge [Flaming Gorge Dam, Daggett County, Utah] and Glenn Canyon Dam [Glen Canyon Dam, Coconino County, Arizona] and they wanted somebody to work on that to look at what is happening here in the way of blasts and what is happening with, as far as earthquakes are concerned. What happens once they start building? What happens when they put the water in and all that? And I'm working on that. So I kept applying, and so by that time, I had advanced to a grade that was higher than what I could come in as a geophysicist, and I was a higher grade. And so I applied again. And I got on the register. Okay, and then there came a time--at the time that this guy--I had developed a very close relationship with several people there. And we were, we were very, very close friends and they liked me because I did the work. And so they pushed for me. So I got the job as a geophysicist. And I had to go down from a GS-7 to a five [GS-5] to come in because they, I couldn't come in as a seven [GS-7]. I had to come in as a five [GS-5]. So I was willing to take the downgrade because the potential was there. I could see that, so I took it. And that's where I got started, and I'm still the only Afro-American, and I'm conspicuous in every way, everywhere I went. But that didn't bother me because I, you know, I'm doing--I'm gonna do my work. I don't care, and I've had a lot of things said to me and a lot of things. I've seen a lot of things that were not right, you know, it's different things. I didn't pay it any attention. I had a goal. I said, that's okay. I'm still gonna do my work. And I, and I just kept working, you know. And so I had people there that had began to respect me for what I did and for what I knew and how I carried myself in doing the work. Nobody gave me anything, nothing. They're not gonna give you anything--no one gave me anything, but I did the work. And so there were people that started to realize, you're doing the work. So therefore, you should be moving. And so that's how I got to moving, and then I'm still the only Afro-American.$Now, in terms of the black community, how do you--I know you're concerned about there not being enough people involved in earth science and other forms of science. How, what do you see as--how can we motivate, you know, more black scientists to--?$$Well, I'll tell you, you know the young generation today as well as I do. And you have to face it. The young generation today, many of the young generation, especially Afro-Americans, they all figure they're gonna be athletes. They all figure they're gonna be professional football players. They're gonna be professional basketball players. And that's where they concentrate, okay. They see a role model. And they think they're gonna be one too. All right, the next thing they see a lot of lawyers. They see a lot of doctors. So, that's where a lot of them want to concentrate into those fields because for us, they don't see many of us. And in many cases, we don't make the money that those people make, you know, the professional [athletes]. We don't make that kind of money. There're kids today, what they're thinking about, how many bucks I'm gonna make, what kind of car am I gonna drive? I go many places to talk today to the kids. The first thing they ask me, "what kind of car you drive?" I say, I drive a bug. What? I say, yeah. So, you know, they see role models, and what they're looking at, is that person out there that's making big bucks and they figure that they're gonna do it too. And you know as well as I know how many professional football you're gonna have, how many professional basketball players you're gonna have, how many really make it and how many don't. So--.$$And it's not many.$$No, so, it's hard as for earth science because they don't see that many role models.$$Now, you get paid--.$$Yeah, we do. We make a decent, and we got a good retirement, good vacation. We make a, we make a decent living.$$And you don't have to cheat anybody.$$No, un-un. No. I'm happy with what I'm doing. Well, everybody want to make more money, yeah, why not? You know (laughter), but I have peace of mind.$$Exciting work.$$Yeah, exciting. That's me. I come to work every day. I never dread coming to work. I come to work every day, I'm, I'm happy. I'm coming, I'm looking for earthquakes (laughter). If I got an earthquake, it's different (unclear). This morning I came in, had one on the borders of Texas and New Mexico, small earthquake, you know, things like that, it's just always exciting, you know.