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Jacquelyn E. Stone

Lawyer Jacquelyn E. Stone was born on January 7, 1958 in Williamsburg, Virginia to William Thomas and Sara Elizabeth Stone. Stone attended the University of Virginia in Charlottesville, Virginia, where she earned her B.A. degree in American government in 1980. She went on to earn her J.D. degree from Harvard Law School in 1985.

From 1980 to 1982, Stone worked as a legislative assistant to U.S. Representative Robert H. Michel. While at Harvard, she was a member of the Harvard Student Bar Association and Harvard Law Forum, and was selected as a Dunster House Pre-Law Advisor. After obtaining her J.D. degree, Stone was hired as an associate at McGuireWoods LLP in Richmond, Virginia, where she focused on business immigration law, regulatory matters and government relations . When she was elected partner at McGuireWoods LLP in 1994, Stone became the first African American woman partner in a major law firm in Virginia. She later became the first African American to serve on McGuireWoods’ Board of Partners. Stone was firmwide Hiring Partner for over twenty years and also created the firm’s Diversity & Inclusion Committee, which she later chaired.

Stone was active in the American Bar Association and was selected as a Fellow of the American Bar Foundation. She also served on the executive committee of the Young Lawyers Section of the Virginia Bar Association and chaired its membership committee. From 1995 to 1998, she was a faculty member for the mandatory Virginia State Bar Harry L. Carrico Professionalism Course. She was also a member of the American Immigration Lawyers Association, and served on the Executive Committee of the Old Dominion Bar Association. Stone has served on multiple organizations’ boards, including Just the Beginning – A Pipeline Organization, Partnership for the Future, The Richmond Forum, Richmond CenterStage Foundation, Venture Richmond, Arts Council of Richmond, Greater Richmond Chamber of Commerce Foundation, Junior Achievement, Leadership Metro Richmond, Local Initiatives Support Corporation, Sorensen Institute for Political Leadership, Richmond Eye and Ear Hospital, Richmond Retirement System, Valentine Museum, United Way and Lewis Ginter Botanical Garden. She was appointed by the Governor of Virginia to the Virginia Commonwealth University Board of Visitors, VCU Health System Board of Directors, Science Museum of Virginia, State Council of Higher Education for Virginia, State Commission on Population Growth and Development, State Council on Local Debt, and Virginia Commission on Competitive and Equitable Tax Policy.

Stone received numerous awards for her work, including the Outstanding Women Award from the YWCA in 2000, and the Themis Award from DuPont Women's Lawyer Network and the Women of Achievement Award from Metropolitan Richmond Women's Bar Association, both in 2005. Stone was also inducted to the Virginia Law Foundation 2010 Class of Fellows. In 2018, Stone was one of only six women to receive a National Women in Law Lifetime Achievement Award from Corporate Counsel and InsideCounsel, leading ALM publications.

Stone and her husband, B. Keith Fulton, have two children: Joshua and Terrell.

Jacquelyn E. Stone was interviewed by The HistoryMakers on December 5, 2016.

Accession Number

A2016.098

Sex

Female

Interview Date

12/5/2016

Last Name

Stone

Maker Category
Marital Status

Married

Middle Name

E.

Occupation
Schools

Harvard Law School

University of Virginia

Walsingham Academy

First Name

Jacquelyn

Birth City, State, Country

Williamsburg

HM ID

STO08

Favorite Season

January

State

Virginia

Favorite Vacation Destination

Cape Town, South Africa

Favorite Quote

Live, Love, Laugh.

Bio Photo
Speakers Bureau Region State

Virginia

Birth Date

1/7/1958

Birth Place Term
Speakers Bureau Region City

Richmond

Country

United States

Favorite Food

Sweet Potatoes

Short Description

Lawyer Jacquelyn E. Stone (1958 - ) specialized in business immigration law and global private client law at McGuireWoods LLP, where she worked for over thirty years.

Employment

McGuireWoods LLP

U.S. House of Representatives

Catepillar Tractor Company

Favorite Color

Red

Timing Pairs
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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Jacquelyn E. Stone's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone lists her favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her mother's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about her maternal grandfather's career

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her mother's education

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her father's family background

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes how her parents met

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her parents' personalities and who she takes after

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Jacquelyn E. Stone lists her siblings

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her earliest childhood memory

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers segregation in Williamsburg, Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers her classes at the Walsingham Academy in Williamsburg, Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about her community in Williamsburg, Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her early interest in law

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her early career aspirations

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her involvement with the American Council on Germany

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her time at the University of Virginia in Charlottesville, Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the integration of the University of Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes the minority recruitment programs at the University of Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers the segregated fraternities and sororities at the University of Virginia

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers her influential professors

Tape: 2 Story: 11 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers working for Congressman Robert H. Michel

Tape: 2 Story: 12 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her admission to Harvard Law School

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the competitive environment at Harvard Law School

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers the faculty of Harvard Law School, pt. 1

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers the faculty of Harvard Law School, pt. 2

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the Harvard Law School Forum

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her resident advisor position at Harvard University

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her classmates at Harvard Law School

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her decision not to pursue a judicial clerkship

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers joining McGuireWoods LLP

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her legal focus at McGuireWoods LLP

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about immigration regulations

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the influential lawyers in Virginia

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers representing The Walt Disney Company, pt. 1

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers representing The Walt Disney Company, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls being made partner at McGuireWoods LLP

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her diversity work at McGuireWoods LLP, pt. 1

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her diversity work at McGuireWoods LLP, pt. 2

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about workplace assimilation

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her work with the Leadership Institute for Women of Color Attorneys, Inc.

Tape: 5 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about her organizational involvement, pt. 1

Tape: 5 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about her organizational involvement, pt. 2

Tape: 5 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers her notable clients

Tape: 5 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her work with Sheila C. Johnson's Salamander Resort and Spa

Tape: 5 Story: 6 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the Just the Beginning Foundation

Tape: 5 Story: 7 - Jacquelyn E. Stone remembers marrying B. K. Fulton

Tape: 5 Story: 8 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes the B. Keith Fulton and Jacquelyn E. Stone STEAM Endowed Scholarship

Tape: 5 Story: 9 - Jacquelyn E. Stone recalls her work with Virginia Commonwealth University

Tape: 5 Story: 10 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her plans for the future

Tape: 5 Story: 11 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her legal philosophy

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her hopes and concerns for the African American Community

Tape: 6 Story: 2 - Jacquelyn E. Stone reflects upon her legacy

Tape: 6 Story: 3 - Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about her family

Tape: 6 Story: 4 - Jacquelyn E. Stone describes how she would like to be remembered

Tape: 6 Story: 5 - Jacquelyn E. Stone narrates her photographs

DASession

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DATape

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DAStory

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DATitle
Jacquelyn E. Stone talks about the influential lawyers in Virginia
Jacquelyn E. Stone describes her work with the Leadership Institute for Women of Color Attorneys, Inc.
Transcript
Now, is there a local chapter of the National Bar Association here?$$ There is, we have a state and local black bar, as we call it. The Old Dominion Bar Association is our state organization. And then the Hill Tucker Bar Association is the Richmond [Virginia] chapter of the Old Dominion Bar.$$And the Hill Tucker Bar is Richmond's, okay (simultaneous).$$ (Simultaneous) Hill Tucker, yeah, named after Oliver Hill [HistoryMaker Oliver W. Hill] and Samuel Tucker [Samuel Wilbert Tucker].$$Yes. Now, I thought so because we interviewed Oliver Hill here. He's the only other Richmond trip that HistoryMakers has made, that I know of, is the one where we interviewed Oliver Hill. And I have a copy of 'The Big Bang' ['The Big Bang, Brown vs. Board of Education and Beyond: The Autobiography of Oliver W. Hill, Sr.,' Oliver W. Hill] and all that he autographed for me (simultaneous).$$ (Simultaneous) Beautiful. He, he made a--$$He was real sharp when we talked to him.$$ I'm--and that could have been when he was a hundred years old. He was$$Really, 'cause there wasn't a time when he wasn't sharp (laughter).$$ Exactly. But, he didn't forget anything and even when he couldn't see, you would tell him who you are and he would start talking as if he knew you for--I mean, and he--I, I--my dad [William T. Stone, Sr.] and I were both people that he knew quite well. And, whenever he would hear my voice, he would ask how my dad is doing and just an amazing, amazing man. And I--$$And now, do you wanna tell whoever is gonna watch this in the future who Oliver Hill is or you want me to do it.$$ You're the historian, you--$$I can just say that Oliver Hill was a part of the famous team of lawyers that was trained by Charles Hamilton Houston at Howard University [Howard University School of Law, Washington, D.C.], which included Thurgood Marshall, Constance Baker [sic.], (unclear) Spottswood Robinson [Spottswood William Robinson III], Charles Duncan [sic.]. This is, this is the historic team that authored the Brown vs. the Board of Education [Brown v. Board of Education of Topeka, 1954] and other such cases that broke down the segregation of schools in the United States.$$ And, Richmond was the home to the law firm of Hill, Tucker and Marsh, which was founded by Oliver Hill and Samuel Tucker, and Henry Marsh [HistoryMaker Henry L. Marsh, III]. And, really have a continued legacy here.$$Right, okay. So, this is special. He was a special member that night. A few years ago, we were in I think Milwaukee [Wisconsin] for the NAACP [National Association for the Advancement of Colored People] convention where they, they presented him with the Spingarn Medal and, you know, Oliver Hill.$$ And he still has family here, so.$$He traveled the country to speak about those positions. I know I found newspaper records of him coming to my hometown in Dayton [Ohio].$$ I'm sure.$$You know, featured by the NAACP as the keynote speaker.$$ I bet, amazing man.$$Yes. So, so, he's a family, family friend?$$ Yes, yes. 'Cause my dad, my dad when he started his practice, I mean, he and Doug Wilder [HistoryMaker L. Douglas Wilder] and Henry Marsh were all contemporaries. And, it wasn't a whole lot of them back then but they were all doing their own practices for the most part, because they--there weren't the larger law firms that would provide opportunities for them to practice. So, they were there hanging their own shingles and going about it. And, they, they really supported each other. I mean, my dad was in Williamsburg [Virginia] but that's, that's less than an hour away from Richmond and, and they all really, really knew each other very well.$Yeah, we're talking about diversity in McGuireWoods [McGuireWoods LLP] and--okay. Now tell us about the, the--the Institute for Women of Color Attorneys Incorporated? The Leadership Institute for Women of Color Attorneys Incorporated [Leadership Institute for Women of Color Attorneys, Inc.].$$ That's one of a number of organizations that has been established to really provide opportunities to expose diverse individuals, be they already in law school or in college or whatever level, to, to really see others who are in the profession. And so, the, the leadership institute was an organization that we got involved with early on and created a McGuireWoods scholarship for a number of diverse women who were either in law school or seeking to, to pursue law. And, we were very pleased to have the opportunity to, to provide funds to really support individuals. There was an extensive application process that was involved, and, and we would, we would help at their, their presentation ceremonies to, to get the money and, and stay in touch with them to make sure that they were continuing on their path.

Roy Chappell

Decorated World War II Air Force veteran and Tuskegee Airman Roy M. Chappell was among a group of African American aviators in the Tuskegee Airmen division that led the way to integrating the armed forces. Born in Williamsburg, Kentucky to Lionel and Flora Chappell, Roy Chappell grew up in Monroe, Michigan, where he was in the top 10 percent of his high school graduating class. In 1940, he left Monroe to attend Kentucky State University, majoring in chemistry. In 1942, during his third year of studies, he was drafted into the armed forces.

In 1944, Chappell underwent navigator training in Hondo, Texas and bombardier training at Randolph Field, Texas. Upon completion, he served as a B-25 bombardier/navigator with the 477th Bombardment Group. In 1945, Chappell was one of the 101 black officers who were arrested for trying to integrate a segregated officers club in what became known as the Freeman Field Mutiny. That same year, Chappell married his wife, Lucy, with whom he had two daughters, Camille and Kathy.

After the war, Chappell completed his education, receiving his B.S. degree in psychology. He went on to become an educator, working as a teacher and guidance counselor in Chicago, Illinois for thirty years, retiring in 1985.

After retiring, Chappell served as the Chicago "DODO" Chapter Tuskegee Airmen President and as the Chairman of the Friends of Meigs Field Board of Directors. On July 25, 2001, Chappell was awarded the Phillips 66 Aviation Leadership Award, recognized as one of the most prestigious civilian aviation awards. Chappell coordinated the Experimental Aircraft Association (EAA) Young Eagles Program and received a Humanitarian Award from the EAA for his efforts. He was also involved with the Chicago Youth in Aviation Project and the Black Star Project of Chicago.

Chappell passed away on September 23, 2002 at age 81.

Accession Number

A2002.073

Sex

Male

Interview Date

5/14/2002

Last Name

Chappell

Middle Name

M.

Organizations
Schools

Kentucky State University

Search Occupation Category
First Name

Roy

Birth City, State, Country

Williamsburg

HM ID

CHA01

Favorite Season

Summer

State

Kentucky

Favorite Vacation Destination

Mexico

Favorite Quote

I Believe I Can Fly.

Bio Photo
Speakers Bureau Region State

Illinois

Birth Date

9/16/1921

Birth Place Term
Speakers Bureau Region City

Chicago

Country

United States

Favorite Food

Chicken (Roasted), Barbeque, Macaroni, Cheese

Death Date

9/23/2002

Short Description

High school teacher and tuskegee airman Roy Chappell (1921 - 2002 ) was the president of the Dodo Chapter of the Tuskegee Airmen. In addition to his work as a teacher, Chappell was also a youth volunteer.

Employment

United States Army Air Corps

Favorite Color

Brown

Timing Pairs
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DAStories

Tape: 1 Story: 1 - Slating of Roy Chappell's interview

Tape: 1 Story: 2 - Roy Chappell lists his favorites

Tape: 1 Story: 3 - Roy Chappell lists his parents and siblings

Tape: 1 Story: 4 - Roy Chappell describes his elementary school in Williamsburg, Kentucky

Tape: 1 Story: 5 - Roy Chappell talks about his parents' backgrounds

Tape: 1 Story: 6 - Roy Chappell describes the sights, sounds and smells of his childhood

Tape: 1 Story: 7 - Roy Chappell recalls memories of his parents

Tape: 1 Story: 8 - Roy Chappell describes participating in sports at Monroe High School in Monroe, Michigan

Tape: 1 Story: 9 - Roy Chappell recalls his social life at Monroe High School in Monroe, Michigan

Tape: 1 Story: 10 - Roy Chappell talks about attending Kentucky State University in Frankfort, Kentucky

Tape: 1 Story: 11 - Roy Chappell recalls the start of World War II

Tape: 1 Story: 12 - Roy Chappell remembers facing racial discrimination in the 1940s

Tape: 1 Story: 13 - Roy Chappell describes his training for the U.S. Army Air Corps

Tape: 2 Story: 1 - Roy Chappell describes the movement to improve opportunities for black servicemen in the 1930s and 1940s

Tape: 2 Story: 2 - Roy Chappell describes cadet training at Tuskegee, Alabama

Tape: 2 Story: 3 - Roy Chappell recalls being lost while learning how to fly a plane

Tape: 2 Story: 4 - Roy Chappell tells the story of Chief Anderson's flight with Eleanor Roosevelt

Tape: 2 Story: 5 - Roy Chappell describes two of his fellow Tuskegee airmen

Tape: 2 Story: 6 - Roy Chappell talks about the casualties during training at Tuskegee, Alabama

Tape: 2 Story: 7 - Roy Chappell talks about continuing his flight training in Hondo, Texas

Tape: 2 Story: 8 - Roy Chappell describes training to be a navigator

Tape: 2 Story: 9 - Roy Chappell talks about the treatment of black officers during training

Tape: 2 Story: 10 - Roy Chappell describes his family's reaction to his military success

Tape: 3 Story: 1 - Roy Chappell talks about the respect his community showed when he returned home from military service as a Tuskegee Airmen

Tape: 3 Story: 2 - Roy Chappell reflects upon race and self-image

Tape: 3 Story: 3 - Roy Chappell describes finishing bombardiering school

Tape: 3 Story: 4 - Roy Chappell describes the protests of the segregated Officers Club at Freeman Field in Indiana

Tape: 3 Story: 5 - Roy Chappell talks about receiving a reprimand for protesting the segregated Officers Club at Freeman Field in Indiana

Tape: 3 Story: 6 - Roy Chappell describes how the Tuskegee Airmen led to the integration of the U.S. Airforce

Tape: 3 Story: 7 - Roy Chappell talks about Commander Benjamin O. Davis

Tape: 3 Story: 8 - Roy Chappell talks about outside pressure to allow the Tuskegee Airmen to go into combat

Tape: 3 Story: 9 - Roy Chappell describes the planes used by bombers during World War II

Tape: 3 Story: 10 - Roy Chappell talks about the heroism of black units in WWII and how it was unrecognized

Tape: 3 Story: 11 - Roy Chappell recalls discrimination in the commercial airline industry following WWII

Tape: 3 Story: 12 - Roy Chappell talks about being discharged and life after his service in the U.S. Air Force

Tape: 3 Story: 13 - Roy Chappell describes teaching at Carnegie Elementary School in Chicago, Illinois

Tape: 4 Story: 1 - Roy Chappell talks about how the Tuskegee Airmen eventually gained recognition

Tape: 4 Story: 2 - Roy Chappell talks about determining who is classified as Tuskegee Airmen

Tape: 4 Story: 3 - Roy Chappell remembers Tuskegee Airman, Mayor Coleman Young

Tape: 4 Story: 4 - Roy Chappell describes his involvement in youth outreach programs, pt.1

Tape: 4 Story: 5 - Roy Chappell describes his involvement in youth outreach programs, pt.2

Tape: 4 Story: 6 - Roy Chappell talks about women in aviation

Tape: 4 Story: 7 - Roy Chappell describes the sights, sounds, and smells of being a Tuskegee Airmen

Tape: 4 Story: 8 - Roy Chappell talks about his children's involvement as Heritage Members

Tape: 4 Story: 9 - Roy Chappell talks about the costly nature of training young black people as pilots

Tape: 4 Story: 10 - Roy Chappell talks about his church involvement and hobbies

Tape: 4 Story: 11 - Roy Chappell talks about lasting friendships from his military career

Tape: 4 Story: 12 - Roy Chappell reflects upon the legacy of the Tuskegee Airmen

Tape: 4 Story: 13 - Roy Chappell talks about how he would like to be remembered

Tape: 4 Story: 14 - Roy Chappell talks about his family

Tape: 4 Story: 15 - Roy Chappell advises young people to join the U.S. Air Force

Tape: 4 Story: 16 - Roy Chappell comments on The HistoryMakers organization

Tape: 4 Story: 17 - Roy Chappell talks about his leadership

Tape: 5 Story: 1 - Roy Chappell narrates his photographs

Tape: 6 Story: 1 - Roy Chappell narrates his photographs

DASession

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DATape

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DAStory

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DATitle
Roy Chappell describes cadet training at Tuskegee, Alabama
Roy Chappell describes the protests of the segregated Officers Club at Freeman Field in Indiana
Transcript
Now, this takes us to, I guess, the next step is Tuskegee [Alabama] itself.$$Right. We got shipped out from Biloxi [Mississippi], and they sent us to Tuskegee [Alabama] to start our cadet training. And the first thing that they did where we were shipped, and they put us in a unit--and we had to go to, like, a day school for about eight or ten weeks, to take some more math and all the basic kind of subjects of that kind. And one of the teachers I remember was Wilkins, I don't know if you're familiar with him or not. But I think Wilkins got his Ph.D. from the University of Chicago when he was about 16 or 17 years old. He was one of the instructors. He instructed us in math. One of the fascinating things about him is that he could be writing--he would write with each hand on the board and be working a different kind of arithmetic problem. You know, and he wasn't but about 18 or 19 years old then. But it was the kind of thing that they had for that. And we went through that. And we stayed in something called the (Emerys?). It's at Tuskegee. Then they moved us over to the base, and we went through a little basic training there. Then they moved us into the--really the flight training program. And the flight--the pilot training program is divided into three parts; a basic, a primary--and the primary, basic, and advanced. And each phase runs about two--two and a half months of training. So we went over and we went into the primary part of the training. And the primary part of training was leased out to the Tuskegee University, and we flew out of what was called Moton Field (ph), which was a ways from Tuskegee. It was all close together. And we flew in a Stearman, where the plane is bi--two wings and things, and that's when I first had a chance to--I know nothing about airplanes. I had no idea. I didn't know anything about them. I had no idea I wanted to fly or anything like that. But this was getting me around what I wanted to get around in the military, so I did. And my instructor, we started flying and we had a number of hours (in about?) it's an open cockpit plane. And after you get a few hours in, you would get the idea that, you know, you're young and you got all this energy and halfway crazy, too. So I decided this particular day, like everybody else, to loosen up my seatbelt and making it very loose, you know, so I'd be real comfortable, I could move around in the seat and everything back there. And they always tried to tell us keep that belt tight. So he flipped this plane over on its back, and here I come sliding up out of this seat. And you talk about somebody having a conniption fit. I said, "Oh, Lord, what am I going to do?" 'Cause I never wanted to jump without a parachute. And he looked--turned around 'cause he's in the front seat. He turned around and looked at me and grinned and said, "Ha-ha-ha-ha." And I said, "Ha-ha-ha," something my mother told me not to say anymore in life, and he, and I said "Turn this thing back over." And he did. But the message was given to me. I learned it, and that was the end of that. No more of that kind of stuff. But it was interesting. And then one day we went up, we came back down, and we landed and we taxied up to where we, you now, go in and they used to pull in off and everything. He said, "Well, we'll stop here for a minute." He stop it. He jumped out. He said, "Okay. It's yours." And so that means I had to go up in solo. So that was the first time that I went up and soloed an airplane and thing. Then we went on through the primary phase of the training and everything, and I got through that in good shape. And, you learn how to do a lot of things. It's amazing what you can do with an airplane and amazing when I look now and think that you can take an airplane and flip it over on its back, you can take it and make it do a loop, and you can do what they call a snap roll, and then snap roll it over quickly and that kind of thing. And you do stalls, 'cause they teach you how in case the plane stumble, what you're supposed to do? And that--and, you know, all those kind of things. And I had no idea about I could ever learn how to do all these things. And it was interesting. And we helped each other, and we got to a real wonderful shape. So I enjoyed that.$So we came in and in a couple of days, they shipped us up to Godman Field, too--not to Godman Field--the Freeman Field. And when we got there, you know, we found out about these two officers clubs, and they had taken the enlisted men's club and made it into an officers club. And the commanding officer was saying that, one club was for instructor personnel, and one was for trainee personnel. And that translated, black and white, because we had some guys there--we had a chaplain there, we had doctors there, and some other--about five--about eight or nine people--about six or seven of them, weren't really in the training program. And we even had some guys there that were back from a tour of duty of the three-thirty-second (3-32nd). And they came back. And so guys started going to the club. And they get there, the man that was in charge of the officers club would tell them that they couldn't come in--they couldn't come in there. The guy was going, he said--and he told them you have to leave or he'll place you under arrest in quarters. So everybody had to go back (unclear) and then go in your quarters and things. And they had hundreds of guys went in there that way. And so the commanding officer there was deciding that this wasn't working. And one of the things that was going on we found out later from the Freedom of Information Act is that he was in contact with the people over him in Washington, D.C., and they were talking about what was going on, what was happening. And so we decided to put out--now, in the military, there was an article of one of the rules said that "any officers club is open to all officers on that base." And he was saying that they could get around this by saying this thing was for officers and trainees. And they told him to write up this memorandum that certain facilities on the base were for instructors and for officers. So and then they did this. He wrote up his personnel. He had a big meeting and read it to everybody and told them, you know, that this thing was coming up. And then he heard again that guys were going to start coming back to the thing. And then he had them come in and had everybody said they would either sign this thing and they understood it and sign it, and read it. Once you do that, you have to comply with it. And so some of us said that we didn't want to do it. We didn't want to sign it. So then they decided to--everybody that hadn't signed it, they had something almost like a little court-martial. Our commanding officer was there, the man who was going to do the questioning was there, and three or four of the officers were there, and the person that was taking the testimony. And they come in, they ask you first thing, "Have you seen the thing? Have you read it?" "Yes." "Will you sign it?" "No." "Well, you could cross out what you don't like and sign it." "No." Then they would read us the Articles of War that has to do with, you know, if you don't obey your commanding officer, and you can get shot and all these other kind of things that can happen. So they finally come down to, say, "Well, scratch out what you don't want and sign it." We says, "No. I won't do that." And so then, finally, they said, "Well, let me read the Articles of War to you again." They read that to us again. And, "A commanding officer gives you a direct order to sign it," to Harry. He says, "I'm not going to sign it." He says, "I'm not going to sign it today. I refuse to sign." So then he was placed back under arrest in quarters. And so that there's a conversation was still going on in the thing. So they decided to ship us back to Godman Field. So we got shipped back; 101 of us got shipped back to Godman Field. The bags were there, they had puts lights up all around the barracks and things, and a fence around barracks and things, and we were all there. And the strange thing about it was, German POWs were able to walk through the barracks, and there was a gas station across the street; they were doing that, and things were going on. See. And these are the kind of things that were going on. And they (simultaneous) (unclear)--$$There were German POWs were at Godman Field.$$At Godman Field. You know (simultaneous) (unclear)--$$They had liberties (simultaneous)--$$--liberties. Right. You know, after they come there so long, they get these kind of liberties. They work in the filling station and that kind of thing.